E10 in my fuel tank!

[JerryL770]

I found myself in Oundle the other day with the needle hovering near the E so I drove to the only petrol station I know in Oundle only to find it closed. So I had to feather the right peddle to get home to Corby and went to the nearest petrol station, the BP at Weldon only to find they had no E5!!

So I splashed a couple of gals E10 in, and went home in the rain, intending to top up with E5 later, but didn't, and now weather conditions preclude taking the car out.

Any thoughts/advice welcome.

[mgcjag]

My only concern would be if there was salt on the roads. ....a bit of E10 will do no harm....just top up with premiem...Steve

[Fuel.inj]

If you are going to lay the car up for a little while, just add a stabiliser additive along with 5-10 litres of E5 from a petrol can and run the car for a while to purge the fuel to the system.

[lopena]

For what it’s worth: I’ve been running my 3.8 liter, 9:1 E-type on unleaded 10% ethanol exclusively for the past 10 or 20 years here in the U.S. with zero ill effects. Nothing has melted, the valves haven’t destroyed their seats and the car starts, idles and runs perfectly.

Find something else to worry about.



Alan
N.J.

[malcolm]

In Europe I often had to run on E10. No harm. Maybe long term with continual use there might be, but I'm sure the occasional tankful will do no harm.

[JerryL770]

Thank you all, Alan AJ in particular

So no need to be bothered about seals and flexi pipes then. I'll bung some E5 in from a couple of cans and run the engine periodically anyway through winter to keep it going.

One "problem" I have is in starting from cold after a period of idleness - 3/4 weeks say. It takes a lot of churning over to get it started with full choke or not so full choke. There after it starts immediately.

Could it maybe the dashpot pistons sticking down? Or something else. 123 leccy ignition (not programmable) and properly set up.

[mgcjag]

Lots of posts on the forum re cold starting difficulty....just try a search....Steve. ....viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13161

[malcolm]

My car also takes loads of churning when it's been left for a while. I think it takes time to draw enough mixture into the big balance pipes. Starts immediately from hot, and from cold when in regular use. So again, I would suggest nothing to worry about. Just make sure you keep your battery topped up! When my car is being left for a while, I use an Optimate conditioner to keep it spot on. I use a Ctek on my F type - does the same thing.

[Tony]

I think it is standard for an E Type to need a lot of turning over when they have not been used for some length of time. I presume it is getting fuel into the carbs that takes the time. After that then they start very easy hot or cold. Just my experience.

Tony

[alfazagato]

A couple of years ago one of the well-known E Type UK specialists was offering an E10 kit....replacement parts for those items which are/might be affected by E10......mostly gaskets and fittings on the fuel delivery lines. Anyone had experience of this kit, did it work and if so is it still available?

Stuart

[JerryL770]

Thanks for replies re: cold starting.

I just wanted to be sure there was no known cause for this with a known cure and to understand if it is a general "problem".

I cannot see it as due to waiting for the carbs to fill as once the pump stops ticking, they are full surely.

Seems rather odd, to me.

[mgcjag]

Hi Jerry.....i refered you to all the previous posts on difficult cold starting......yes many have this problem. ...but there is plenty you can do......are your carbs set up correctly....especially the choke. ....enrichment to pull the jets down correctly when you operate the choke lever.....dont just assume your carb are correct....check them out....also dont press the throttle pedal when trying to start on choke.......Steve

[malcolm]

Thanks for replies re: cold starting.

I just wanted to be sure there was no known cause for this with a known cure and to understand if it is a general "problem".

I cannot see it as due to waiting for the carbs to fill as once the pump stops ticking, they are full surely.

Seems rather odd, to me.

I don't think it's waiting for the carbs to fill; as you say, when it stops ticking, theyre full. It's more to do with the balance tube that the mixture is drawn into .

[RICHOT]

One good thing about a lot of engine churning before starting when the car hasn't been started for a while is it gets the oil circulating before firing up.
I have an ignition cut-out switch which I use to do exactly this - turn the engine over until the oil pressure rises, then fire it up.
Also, I have a fuel cut-out switch which I switch on when I am ready to fire up so that I don't get bore wash from petrol when churning the engine over.

Cheers,

Richard

[mach2andy]

My car suffers with poor cold starting as well. Left for a week or so it's fine. But left for 2 weeks or more it's not good at all. The engine just stumbles but won't properly catch. It does this quite a number of times before it starts properly. The best explanation I've read was from Andrew down under.....

If you leave a car with SUs to sit the fuel in the bowls will evaporate; they're open to atmosphere. I assume this is also true of Strombergs.

So after a while whatever fuel is in there (if any) isn't fresh and has lost the more volatile (and flammable) hydrocarbons. Depending on your tune this may make the car harder to start.

[mtnjag]

I think it does partially to do with fuel but not so much the float bowl. Those are quickly filled with fresh fuel by the pump once the key is turned on. Wait a few seconds for them to fill and they are ready as ever.

However, fuel is left in the carb throat and a charge of unburned fuel in the cylinder when you shut down.
If starting in a few days it remains and is ready to ignite immediately.
If left for a longer period it will evaporate and the engine will take a little longer to ignite.

Also, if oil pressure is achieved through cranking with no ignition or fuel pump, and if the float bowls have fuel in them, it will still result in unburned fuel washing the cylinder walls as the engine will draw the fuel in causing wear. I have seen electric charging pumps used for this purpose if felt necessary.

Other factors also contribute to slow starting of course. And excessive cranking looks to additional issues.

The lack of fuel remaining in the cylinder is one huge contribution mulitpoint electronic fuel injection has made to engine longevity. Unlike carbs it stops the fuel when the ignition is shut off and charges the cylinder immediately at first crank. No excess fuel to wash the cylinder walls then or in other performance areas.

[alfazagato]

It is true that modern fuel "goes off" quite quickly and it becomes more difficult to start an engine. I have no information as to whether E5 is better than E10 in this regard... any facts on this?

Stuart

[mtnjag]

If E 5 , 5% alcohol, goes off faster than 100% gas then yes E10, 10% alcohol, would go off a little faster.
Sealed fuel supply systems help longevity.
A 62 E with a vented cap will go off faster than whenever jag went to a sealed system with a non-vented cap and the vapor recirc system. Early 70s?
Early systems can be helped with the use of MODERN vented fuel caps which have a one way valve. It allows an inward draw of air but needs 3-4#s of pressure in the tank to vent out. For example if you filled up cold and the fuel warmed you would not get fuel evap unless pressure built beyond the low pressure valve.
I don’t believe any of the “ correct” caps have that feature but you don’t see it on a Jag and it is easily switched when wanted. Motorad makes a modern cap that fits.

And in general the higher the octane the longer it will last in the tank or can. Of course it still evaps in the carb.
So finish your year with race gas if you start periodically or run the carbs out of gas before storage.
A full tank is better for storage but bad-for a bunch of old gas at some point. I believe an empty tank with fog of WD40 periodically depending on storage length would be good.
If you have a tank sealed with a good product then empty is ideal.

[SimonBrown]

My E Type also takes a lot of cranking before starting if left for more than a couple of weeks.
Years ago I had a Herald 13/60 with a Stromberg carb. Always started easily, no matter how long left. However, when fitted with twin SU carbs from a Spitfire it was very difficult to start if left for a longer period. This had a mechanical fuel pump so it may be an SU issue.

[mtnjag]

Do Strombergs have an accelerator pump like a Holley or Carter?