Ride Height

Technical advice Q&A
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skiday
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#21 Re: Ride Height

Post by skiday » Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:47 pm

No, Same tyres, just slightly different design wheels. Not by choice. Thinking about it, the wheels have to have the exact same dimensions or the tyres wouldn't fit.
Andrew Day. Former owner of S1A 4.2 2+2. Current cars; Aston Martin DBS 1968, Ferrari F355 & Fiat Coupe 20vt. Flag of choice; EU

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skiday
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#22 Re: Ride Height

Post by skiday » Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:42 pm

I'm just looking at the manual for the camber and castor angles and whilst CASTOR seems fair enough and 2º±½º positive, as you will still be in positive if you are within tolerances, but CAMBER is quoted at ¼º±½º pos which means if you are just under ½º out in the direction of neg you could have no camber or negative camber even though you are within tolerances. Is my understanding right?
Andrew Day. Former owner of S1A 4.2 2+2. Current cars; Aston Martin DBS 1968, Ferrari F355 & Fiat Coupe 20vt. Flag of choice; EU

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skiday
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#23 Re: Ride Height

Post by skiday » Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:45 pm

In my attempt to eliminate excessive stiffness in the steering, today I have been looking at the steering rack and the rack pinion box.

In the manual, page I.5 shows the box without any spring, whereas mine has a spring inside.

Image


Image

There is no update to this design in the I.Y. section. So I am left wondering if I have a replacement steering rack or if Jaguar updated it for '68 and the Series 1.5

It exerts a constant pressure onto the rack which adds friction to the operation which would not have been there if the design were as the diagram. When the rack is set dead ahead there is a very slight dip in the plunger, so when I assemble the unit without the spring the cap can move ever so slightly when the rack is dead ahead, but it tight when steering is added. The operation seems good and without slack but with less stiffness without the spring, so could I leave it out, which means if it is set as on page I.7 it will be the same as the design in the manual?

I've just noticed that the instructions on page i.7 call for a 'Belleville washer', but it is not shown in the illustration on I.5 (above) which is very strange. I suppose therefore if there is no Belleville washer than there needs to be the spring.
Last edited by skiday on Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Andrew Day. Former owner of S1A 4.2 2+2. Current cars; Aston Martin DBS 1968, Ferrari F355 & Fiat Coupe 20vt. Flag of choice; EU

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mark10337
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#24 Re: Ride Height

Post by mark10337 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 7:02 pm

The Series 2 has a spring. It can be seen here.


Image

The rack and pinion assembly changed in Jun 1965, including a new housing SPB I..56 and between Sep-Oct 965 was revised to a seven tooth pinion instead of eight. SPB I...58, SBI.25
-Mark

1969 Series 2 OTS, Regency Red
'Life's to short to drive a boring car'

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#25 Re: Ride Height

Post by skiday » Wed Nov 22, 2017 10:54 pm

Hi Mark

Is that diagram from the manual, because I can't find it in mine (which is for series 1 & 2)? If so, what page is that?
Andrew Day. Former owner of S1A 4.2 2+2. Current cars; Aston Martin DBS 1968, Ferrari F355 & Fiat Coupe 20vt. Flag of choice; EU

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#26 Re: Ride Height

Post by mark10337 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 11:35 pm

Hi

It is from XKE Books for the Series 2. The same set of images are used on various supplier's websites incl. SNG.
The diagrams are not Jaguar ones and were commissioned especially for XKE Books for the Series 2.

45-13 C.20145 Plunger, at top of Housing
45-14 C.15199 Shim (0.004"), at top of Plunger - As required
45-14 C.15198 Shim (0.010"), at top of Plunger - As required
45-15 C.20146 Spring, under Cover
45-16 C.20147 Cover, retaining Plunger, Spring, and Shims
45-17 C.15202 Circlip, securing Cover
-Mark

1969 Series 2 OTS, Regency Red
'Life's to short to drive a boring car'

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44DHR
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#27 Re: Ride Height

Post by 44DHR » Thu Nov 23, 2017 12:50 pm

Andrew,
I appreciate that you mentioned this steering rack issue earlier in this thread, but it probably would have been better to start a new Topic thread as we all learn from each other on this forum. You are now looking at the steering rack rather than your original front suspension issue and this response is now buried down here.
I only came on this thread to see if you resolved your original front suspension subject - if it has settled or been correctly resolved by your Jaguar specialist - but as I am also on the Island, please feel free to call me or call round about this new issue.
It would help to refer to the correct Jaguar publications as you appear to quote the early 3.8 Series 1 Service Manual, rather use the later 4.2 information for your 4.2 Series 2. The later steering racks with the coil spring are easily identified externally by the domed cover, compared to the flat earlier covers. The earlier racks use a “Belleville” spring washer, which is a dished washer to provide the spring pressure once the endfloat is correctly shimmed. Belleville washers are used in the Salisbury Powr-Lok Limited Slip Differential, but the problem with these are that they can crack and not then provide the spring compression.
I have a steering rack presently on the bench as we tend to rebuild the racks with the later 7 tooth Pinion with a 8 tooth “Sports” Pinion, so all the parts are available to see here. I also have the correct drifts to replace the Pinion bearings. I would also suggest you check the Slipper Pad, or “Plunger”, which bears against the steering rack and it can wear.
All individual parts are available from Kiley-Clinton Engineering in Birmingham who have only manufactured steering rack components for the original car manufacturers - check out their website to see how specialised they are.
Trust this helps,
Regards,
Dave
Dave Rose
1967 Series 1 4.2 FHC

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#28 Re: Ride Height

Post by skiday » Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:07 am

Hi folks

My ride height and steering issue is now fully resolved. The height (as best as I can measure it) is bang on on the right side and 3mm high on the left as measured on page J.X.s.2 of the manual (I suspect the rear suspension may be a little low on the right side, which may influence the front - but 3mm! that's hardly anything). The steering is beautifully light (for a non-powered steering car) :swerve: and now returns to centre as it should. St Helens Garage checked over the geometry and all the work. An added bonus is that all the creaking from the suspension has gone as when I had the upper wishbones of the hubs I sprayed lubricant into all the bushes and worked them till they stopped squeaking so it's much quieter too. I took it for a long drive in the beautiful sunshine today and was very pleased with the handling. So for all the advice :thankyouyellow:

Now i just have to sort out my low oil pressure and I have found the heated rear window doesn't work, so I shall move to other threads (I have found the one on low oil pressure already)

Andrew
Andrew Day. Former owner of S1A 4.2 2+2. Current cars; Aston Martin DBS 1968, Ferrari F355 & Fiat Coupe 20vt. Flag of choice; EU

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Gfhug
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#29 Re: Ride Height

Post by Gfhug » Fri Dec 29, 2017 8:43 am

Andrew, good to hear you're sorted.
My HRW problem was hard to locate, eventually found to be a poor earth connection from the screen itself. I had to disconnect both sides at the heater element and gradually trace along all the connections.
That might help you. Good hunting!

Geoff
S2 FHC Light Blue

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#30 Re: Ride Height

Post by Hugo » Mon Jan 01, 2018 6:57 pm

skiday wrote:
Thu Nov 09, 2017 7:31 pm
I was just thinking about the 10mm difference. If the rear suspension were lop sided that would surely affect the front of a car with the front perfectly set up. I have measured and it is 5mm lower on the R/H at the rear.
I wonder how much discrepancies at the front affect the rear and vice-versa.
You would need to measure the weight at each wheel to get to the bottom of this ;)
Hugo Miller - rebuilding an imported Series II OTS & converting to RHD

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#31 Re: Ride Height

Post by PeterCrespin » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:16 am

skiday wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 1:07 am
Hi folks

My ride height and steering issue is now fully resolved. The height (as best as I can measure it) is bang on on the right side and 3mm high on the left as measured on page J.X.s.2 of the manual (I suspect the rear suspension may be a little low on the right side, which may influence the front - but 3mm! that's hardly anything).

Andrew
You've got that spot-on I reckon. Always check the diagonally opposite wheel, not the same side. A low front right means probably a high rear left and high front left means a low rear right etc.

Technically, weighing the four corners (with the other three on blocks to the same height as you scale) will tell you what's what, but the weights will be way higher than any household bathroom scale, so you may as well go by height and you're as good as there already.
1E75339 UberLynx D-Type; 1R27190 70 FHC; 1E78478; 79 S2 XJ12L; 97 XJ6L

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