Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

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Jonny XKE
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#1 Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:03 pm

I wanted to take the wheels off today but could only undo 1 of the spinners. I used so much force on the others that I actually broke the ratchet I was using. The wheel with the spinner I could take off I then couldn't get the wheel off. It's a well maintained car and fairly recently restored. Also just been in for a service and mot. What am I doing wrong!?
S1.5 FHC 4.2 OSB 1968

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mgcjag
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#2 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by mgcjag » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:16 pm

If your useing a ratchet im not supprised it broke unless a large 3/4 drivd....I would go back to old school and use a spinner hammer.....you can use a length of 4x2 on the ear and hit other end......if you cant pull the wheel off then its seized so not greased properly...Steve
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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Mich7920
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#3 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Mich7920 » Sat Feb 29, 2020 6:18 pm

Hi,
Certainly a stupid question but do you turn in the good way ?
The "undo" on the spinner is'nt the same for left and right.
If the way is ok, the last guy who touched your wheels tightened them too much.
Try with a "truck" ratchet 3/4" and a long bar.
If it's very tighten a hammer is going to hurt your spinner.
Michel
1965 E Type FHC - On the road - 1963 E Type OTS - Angus Restoration
Gran Torino Sport 1975 - Renault 4cv 1956 - CItroen 15/6 1951 - CItroen Traction 1945
Citroen Coupé docteur 5Hp 1924 - Citroen B12 1926 - Torpedo Sygma 1913
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abowie
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#4 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by abowie » Sun Mar 01, 2020 2:55 am

Buy a lead hammer and smack the crap out of the spinner. £20 or so from the usuals.

Spinners undo toward the front of the car on both sides. There are arrows on them showing direction.
Andrew.
881824, 1E21538. 889457..oops. Jezza the V12 XJS race car.
http://www.projectetype.com/index.php/the-blog.html
Adelaide, Australia

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MarkRado
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#5 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by MarkRado » Sun Mar 01, 2020 5:22 am

I use a 1" crosshandle in combination with a pipe as extension
Mark
1963 OTS 880436

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#6 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:38 am

You would think getting the wheels off was the easy bit!! Tried a lead hammer with and without the wooden gadget. Tried the metal machined attachment with a breaker bar with considerable force. Will try again today.

Are there also any tricks to get stuck on wheels off?
S1.5 FHC 4.2 OSB 1968

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#7 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by mgcjag » Sun Mar 01, 2020 8:49 am

If your wheel is stuck on the then you could get some penetrating oil in there....kick the tyre hard around the wall..this could just break the seal thats holding it...i have had to use a builders heavey club hammer to undo spinners..a piece of wood to protect the ear....Steve
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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Jeremy
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#8 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jeremy » Sun Mar 01, 2020 10:25 am

Penetrating oil: try PlusGas. I found it seeped and spread further than WD-40...it enabled me to release rusted suspension bolts where WD did not. Spray it in everywhere and leave it overnight to soak in.
Jeremy
1967 S1 4.2 FHC

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#9 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:27 am

Thank you everyone and have ordered some help ... pipe for breaker bar, plus gas and a builders rubber mallet
S1.5 FHC 4.2 OSB 1968

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angelw
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#10 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by angelw » Sun Mar 01, 2020 11:50 am

Jonny Wrote:
I wanted to take the wheels off today but could only undo 1 of the spinners. I used so much force on the others that I actually broke the ratchet I was using.
Hello Jonny,
Given your reference to a ratchet, you must have a device that will accept a Socket Wrench of some kind. That being so, I would use a robust Breaker Bar and employ an added lever to increase your mechanical advantage.

As Archimedes reportedly announced, "give me a place to stand and with a lever I will move the whole world", you will do better with a long lever than the short lever presented when hitting the wings of the spinner with a hammer. Sure you get the shock and inertia applied by a hammer blow, but leverage will win out in the end.

As well as using a penetrating oil to help overcome friction, I would also use heat on the spinner, particularly that area that correspond to the internal taper that mates with the taper of the wheel centre. The spinner is made of a bronze alloy, which has a greater coefficient of expansion than steel and therefore, should ease its grip on the wheel centre as it expands. I would play the heat on the face of the spinner, out towards the outside area of the circular form of the part. This should have the affect of expanding the female thread and taper of the spinner, both being beneficial to loosening the grip of the spinner. Have your breaker bar and extension lever ready to apply as soon as the spinner is nearly too hot to touch. Use a heat gun and you will do no damage to either the spinner or the wheel.

Regards,

Bill

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Mich7920
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#11 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Mich7920 » Sun Mar 01, 2020 12:23 pm

:yeahthat:
Michel
1965 E Type FHC - On the road - 1963 E Type OTS - Angus Restoration
Gran Torino Sport 1975 - Renault 4cv 1956 - CItroen 15/6 1951 - CItroen Traction 1945
Citroen Coupé docteur 5Hp 1924 - Citroen B12 1926 - Torpedo Sygma 1913
Harley D. 1915 sidecar

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#12 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Sun Mar 01, 2020 6:38 pm

Thank you Bill.

Have also now just ordered a heat gun.

I should now have all the tools!

Will let you know which method does the job! Thanks again
S1.5 FHC 4.2 OSB 1968

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#13 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by 44DHR » Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:30 am

Sorry for coming late to the party, but I avoid using excessive heat to remove stuck or metal bonded items, by going to the reverse process by freezing the items.
An essential item in my workshop is Freezer Spray - not the plumbing type where pipes are frozen to work on - but specific metal freezing spray which also contains a powerful penetrating oil which creeps in to break the seal.
The one I use is called “”Crack-it” Shock - Freeze Release Spray, made by Arctic Hayes and available from various UK suppliers, such as Screwfix around £7.45 for a 400ml aerosol can. This claims to freeze the two components down to -50 degrees C, once the seized components are sprayed for 30 to 40 seconds, then given firm force after 1 minute. Sometimes, you can hear a distinct crack as the bond is broken between the two components as the freezing action takes place between them.
I have successfully freed metal components, such as metal bushes which have effectively rusted and “grown” into their surrounding mountings in otherwise almost impossible situations. The advantage of cold over heat is there is less risk of fire damage to surrounding areas.
I highly recommend this product - I have no affiliation other than a very satisfied user.
The only time I do use heat to an advantage on my spinners, is when I know I will be removing the wheels later in the workshop, I always loosen them with a few hard knocks using my heavy No 3 hide faced Thor hammer after a run out in the car, when they will be warm.
Regards,
Dave
Dave Rose
1967 Series 1 4.2 FHC

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#14 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by angelw » Mon Mar 02, 2020 12:19 pm

Hello Dave,
Where you have two materials of considerable difference in thermal coefficient of expansion and where the female component of an assembly is the one with the greater coefficient of expansion, as is the case with a steel wheel centre and bronze alloy spinner, freezing the assembly is highly unlikely to aid in separating the two.

The OP's situation is that the wheels are assembled on the hubs and therefore, it would be difficult to freeze the wheel centre without freezing the spinner to a greater degree. Further, even if the two components were to be cooled to the same extent, the spinner (the female component) will shrink more than the wheel centre (the male component) and therefore, result in more interference between the two parts than when at ambient temperature.

Heating the spinner until almost too hot to touch is not within a Bull's Roar of excessive heat.

The OP has expressed a desire to remove the wheels; accordingly, that would satisfy your criteria for using heat to aid in removing the spinners.

Regards,

Bill

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#15 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by 44DHR » Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:15 pm

Hi Bill,
Yes, a good point in this instance and I perfectly understand the issue of freezing the accessible Female component - the spinner - which potentially would contract against against the Male component.
I just wanted to highlight this alternative method of freeing seized metal components and how the cracking action to break the joint appears to occur a minute or two after the application of the freezing spray as the two components “settle” back to ambient.
This spray is now an essential tool in my workshop where it can be suitably used.
Regards,
Dave
Dave Rose
1967 Series 1 4.2 FHC

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Mich7920
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#16 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Mich7920 » Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:46 pm

If your whells will stay on the car with all these guys, tapping, freezing, warming, oiling etc...
Change the car ! :mrgreen:
Michel
1965 E Type FHC - On the road - 1963 E Type OTS - Angus Restoration
Gran Torino Sport 1975 - Renault 4cv 1956 - CItroen 15/6 1951 - CItroen Traction 1945
Citroen Coupé docteur 5Hp 1924 - Citroen B12 1926 - Torpedo Sygma 1913
Harley D. 1915 sidecar

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#17 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by MSM » Mon Mar 02, 2020 6:42 pm

If your car has just come back from a service and the wheels are stuck on I would seriously question returning to the same establishment ever again!!
Mike

S2 FHC

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Jonny XKE
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#18 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Mon Mar 02, 2020 8:32 pm

Just for good measure I've ordered some of that freeze spray too. Thank you.

I've also sent an email to the garage who serviced it.
S1.5 FHC 4.2 OSB 1968

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#19 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Jonny XKE » Sun Mar 08, 2020 4:18 pm

I now have the spinners off (lead hammer), they were on very tight. One wheel won't come off. Tried builders rubber hammer but won't budge. It's on axle stands so will try the driving in circles at some at some point. The chrome wire wheels have started to rust, they they have only had a few years use. I won't be able to live with these. What are the options?

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#20 Re: Spinners stuck and wheels stuck on!

Post by Series1 Stu » Sun Mar 08, 2020 4:23 pm

Borrani's, if you're feeling flush or Turrino wheels for slightly less. Both are aluminium rims with stainless spokes and both are achingly beautiful. Well, very nice at least. :lol:

Regards
Stuart

If you can't make it work, make it complicated!

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