Overdrive in 2+2

Technical advice Q&A

1954Etype
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#21 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by 1954Etype » Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:44 pm

Steve, confirm the ball pein hammer for the right angle drive. We have to cut the propshaft tunnel at the front on both of the cars to provide a bit of room. As you say, the tolerances in those days.......
Angus 65 OTS 1E11497. 67 FHC 1E33656

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PeterCrespin
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#22 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by PeterCrespin » Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:59 pm

mgcjag wrote:
Thu Nov 15, 2018 2:02 pm
...he did not have to cut or weld anything for the new o/d box to fit......however the speedo drive did touch the tunnel so he used a ball pin hammer to slighty indent the tunnel so it didnt touch......this conflicts re the cut and weld mentioned by Angus above....this could be due to all compact o/d units not being exacxtly the same shape or tunnel shape......so it is a bit of try and see if it fits.and alter as required....Steve
The reason IMO is also because of variability in engine & gearbox mounts, both in term of parts and fitment. The Compact type A won't vary in size any more than you'd expect an engine or diff to vary. Sheet metal is different and so are the rubber hardness and spring stiffness.

I have half a dozen spring which vary appreciably. A few have paint marks I can't decipher, most are just oily black. They hold the gearbox at different heights and uprated metal-capped engine mounts or a tilted engine do the same. I think these variances plus installation variability account for lots of the clearance range.
1E75339 UberLynx D-Type; 1R27190 70 FHC; 1E78478; 97 XJ6L

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Maxa
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#23 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by Maxa » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:01 pm

Many thanks guys, It does rather confirm what we all know in that there is no such thing as a standard car. The factory just used whatever was to hand and if it didn’t fit they made it fit.
I will make up a jig to offer up the ex S type box and short tail o/d and prepare to cut and shut.
Using this box and o/d is a change of direction for me as I had previously sourced a Tremec 5 spd from Beagle/Elite in Stoke not knowing that my 2+2 would accept an o/d box easily. Should have gone to Specsavers!
Or read the helpful postings on the forum. Anyone want a Tremec box?

Regards Michael
:thankyouyellow:

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mgcjag
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#24 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by mgcjag » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:19 pm

Put the Tremac in the wanted/Sale section...Steve
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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JJC
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#25 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by JJC » Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:21 pm

I would be shocked if you didn't sell the Tremec box in short order. Great box.....and another alternative to fitting an overdrive.....both offer a great solution to reducing RPM's on long drives.

Best of luck !

JJ

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PeterCrespin
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#26 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by PeterCrespin » Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:45 pm

"It does rather confirm what we all know in that there is no such thing as a standard car. The factory just used whatever was to hand and if it didn’t fit they made it fit. "

I don't know that, and common sense (as well as meticulous car-by-car factory records) suggest it is highly unlikely to be anything more than a myth, apart from a very few exceptions such the use of OTS seats in some 3.8 FHCs.

Were the cars as laser-perfect as an F-TYPE robotic line is today? Of course not. Did hand fettling leave a few millimetres of variance in bodywork, such that new bumpers (or OD box fit) can need ajustment? Sure it did. But the idea that you could run a complex assembly line on an ad-hoc basis, is implausible on its face. You can just imagine the effect on stock control if staff were routinely stymied by mis-matched parts ordering and line supply.

And then post-sale, if a warranty issue crops up and the dealer orders parts by the car number, only to receive the wrong parts - which are actually the right parts for that VIN but it turns out his customer 's car was fitted with undocumented items lying around and meant for some other use? Not likely IMO, especially in the strike-prone 60s and 70s.
1E75339 UberLynx D-Type; 1R27190 70 FHC; 1E78478; 97 XJ6L

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Series1 Stu
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#27 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by Series1 Stu » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:49 pm

:yeahthat:

Such myths seem to endure because it makes the manufacturer appear a twee underdog. Best not to let the facts get in the way of a good story.

Regards
Stuart

If you can't make it work, make it complicated!

'62 FHC - Work In (slow) Progress
'69 Daimler 420 Sovereign
'94 X300 XJR basket case

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Maxa
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#28 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by Maxa » Fri Nov 23, 2018 8:57 pm

Blimey, I think I’ve just been Crespin ed! Do I get a badge? I know how Pike must have felt. `(Sorry Peter you probably don’t have Dads Army in the Colonies).
Clearly I should have said”a dimensionally standard car”.
I wonder if the factory guys who fettled the bonnets thought the cars were standard. Did they never select a different bonnet to achieve a better initial fit? Should have checked the VIN number.
As to VINs in the strike prone 60s and 70s I bow to Peter’s superior knowledge.
Do not be flippant when posting or Peter will get you.
Reprimand accepted. I will do better. Michael.

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PeterCrespin
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#29 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by PeterCrespin » Wed Nov 28, 2018 12:33 pm

Ha! “My mum’s favourite programme.”

Why the speech marks? Because it’s a direct quote of what I said to Ian Lavender (Private Pike) in the mid Seventies when Dad’s Army was at its peak.

I was a student and working at the Heath Hospital in Cardiff, when Patrick Cargill (Father Dear Father) and Lavender visited the hospital. I suppose they were the thespian equivalent of the Queen and Prince Philip. Lavender smiled wanly and rolled his eyes a bit - he had clearly been paid the ‘mum’ compliment a few times before. So I quickly switched the topic to motorcycles. There had been an episode featuring one and my daily ride was an ex-Army BSA at the time.

I will admit to being surprised that Lavender had mostly white hair but all credit to him for not dyeing it off the set and taking twenty years off his age.

I’m a bit tall for Captain Mainwaring and probably more of a Sergeant Wilson. No pomp and very little circumstance, but occasionally exasperated by daft OWTs. Sorry you copped for it - no offence.
1E75339 UberLynx D-Type; 1R27190 70 FHC; 1E78478; 97 XJ6L

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christopher storey
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#30 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by christopher storey » Wed Nov 28, 2018 4:22 pm

I needed a good laugh and the last few exchanges have given me one :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Maxa
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#31 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by Maxa » Wed Nov 28, 2018 7:21 pm

Peter, No offence taken. Thanks for a good laugh. Michael

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Malc
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#32 Re: Overdrive in 2+2

Post by Malc » Sun Feb 24, 2019 2:51 pm

David - don’t know whether you have sorted yourself out yet, but just picked up this topic so here is my two penny worth. I have a 1968 S1 2+2. I managed to find a overdrive ‘box from a 1968 S-Type. I had the ‘box and overdrive rebuilt (by separate specialists). Engice came out, old ‘box removed and new ‘box just bolts on (remember to replace the clutch while you’re there).

There are minor mods to the tunnel. You need to cut the tunnel between the propshat access panel and the gearbox aperture and widen it by about two to three millimetres as the gearbox, due to the o/d unit, is slightly wider at this point. A plate can be easily riveted on afterwards. Plus you will need to bash out the driver’s side of the tunnel where the side access plate is in order to make sure the speedo drive does not foul/rub. It is located in a different position to the E-Type. The cover plate will have to be also ‘rounded’ to make sure it fits.

Another good thing is that the top plate of the o/d box (assuming you get one from an S-Type or 420) is the same. I got a new gear lever from an XJ with the flick switch in the top of the gear lever knob (I think it was from a Triumph) - very neat and easy to use although you could always do a separate switch a la XKs either on the centre console or on the dash.

It all works really well although, due to other circumstances, I have not yet driven it many miles but it certainly make a lot of difference on the motorway.

Angus is yer man for this - he had more than a hand in mine (and a couple of fingers).
Malc

Series 1 2+2, 1968 Blue exterior, grey interior

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