Ride height - Torsion bars

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JD-JAG66
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#21 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:05 pm

Hello Again,
I am not out of the woods...
Moved the car to a paint shop, and noticed that the nose was still quite low. Measurements showed 21.1 cm. And that is without the bumpers fitted, but with the rear suspension not yet settled.
Basically I am still +/- 1.5 cm short of the recommended height.
Now, as I already mentioned in this thread, I could not find any indication on left or right side for the torsion bars, so I fitted them back where they were.
Has anybody fitted torsion bars on the wrong side and measured the ride height? Or can anybody give an estimate on what the ride height would/could be?
Since the lower wishbones can't be pushed any further down when fitting the torsion bars in line with received instructions, I guess I cannot increase the ride height any more?
I will anyway dismantle everything again and start over before I fork out 460£ for new torsion bars...
Cheers
Jan
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#22 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by mgcjag » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:57 am

Hi Jan....did you page J.X.s.1 in the service manual to work out what setting length setting link you should be useing and the following page to calculate the ride height.......if you are still too low you need to reajust the torsion bar........there is no way of telling how much lower the car will sit if you are useing worn out bars or the left swapped for tbe right........note that on the pages i mention above it gives different measurements for cars with a/c and larger diameter bars.... Steve
Edit....Jan..you did mention that you cant push your lower wishbone down any more......do you have them fitted the correct way around.....the front arm of the wishbone are handed so there is a left one and a right one....where the torsion bar fits in there is a machined cut out that if fitted the wrong way around stops the wishbone lowering it will be stopped on the frame... Steve
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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#23 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 3:45 pm

Thanks for the feedback Steve,
I have indeed checked with the shop manual instructions, but increased the setting link length to its maximum of 47 cm (wishbone hitting the frame) in stead of the 46.5 cm mentioned for a car with airconditioning (which mine does not have)

Could you confirm what you mean by :"where the torsion bar fits in there is a machined cut out that if fitted the wrong way around stops the wishbone lowering it will be stopped on the frame..."

I think I have fitted each wishbone on the correct side, confirming with pictures of restored cars on the internet, or with pictures after dismantling them from my car.


Image

Image

Considering the "pre-restoration" condition of I presume that torsion bar and wishbone had never been apart, and therefore it seems that I will have to bite the bullet and get new torsion bars. :sad:

Jan
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#24 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by mgcjag » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:21 pm

Hi Jan if you look close at the attached photo you can see the torsion bar going through the wishbone...where the end comes out and you can see the splines on that side of the wishbone its machine thinner..you can see the end of the machined cut just to the right of the small retaining pin/nut...cant see close enough on your 1st photo......but see in your second one that its the correct way aroung

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Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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#25 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:32 pm

Thanks Steve,
Indeed, it looks like I fitted the wishbones the right way, so basically the torsion bars are either on the wrong side (very unlikely) or unfortunately past their best...
Have a great evening
Jan
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#26 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by mgcjag » Wed Jan 10, 2018 4:38 pm

Hi Jan.....why do your wishbones hit the frames.....without the torsion bar out you should be able to push them right down.......you can see in my photo that the cutout is there so the wishbone clears the frame
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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#27 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:57 pm

Hello Steve,
I can push down the lower wishbone until I can measure 47 cm for the setting link length. I will check tomorrow whether the wishbone hits the bolts of the window frame. But considering that the setting length should be +/- 46.8 cm I should achieve a height of at least 23cm in the end.
I could not find any indication or left/right side on my torsion bars, but considering the condition they were in when I removed them, I am quite confident that they are fitted on the correct side.
I hate sounding pessimistic, but it looks like I am running out of options....
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#28 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by mgcjag » Thu Jan 11, 2018 8:53 am

Hi Jan.....the page i quoted for the setting link measurements shows a 2+2 with air con as 48.87cm where are you seeing that you should set to 46.8cm.....Steve
Steve
1969 S2 2+2 & Building a C type replica

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#29 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by Maikel » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:42 am

I simply added 0.5 cm to the indicated distance in the workshop manual.
Have done it and is spot on.
The bars might have suffered some loss of strength over the past 50 years.
It also says in the manual, that the petrol tank should be filled, if those 60 liters in the back do make a difference to the front, then maybe 10 kg of filler and extra paint does give another reason for low front clearance. That all made me add these 0.5 cm for compensation.
Sure, it is near the limit to get this distance of 47 cm but it is possible.
Make sure you do not bend the top "ears" of the picture frame.

Maikel

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#30 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 12:42 pm

Thanks!!!
Will check wishbone "blocking" issues and see if I can get indeed to 48.87 cm!!
Here's to hoping that I don't need to spend 470£!
Cheers
Jan
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#31 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by chrisfell » Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:20 pm

I have a feint recollection of a problem with my car. When using the correct setting link dimensions I realised I couldn’t get the wishbone to drop enough until after I’d removed the TB pinch bolt.
Chris '67 S1 2+2

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#32 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by JD-JAG66 » Thu Jan 11, 2018 5:54 pm

The Torsion bar pinch bolt is the little bolt that keeps the TB fixed onto the wishbone, no?
I have removed the torsion bar completely, for which this bolt needed to come out. So this should not be the case on mine.
I checked the lengths of the bolts used on the window frame and they seem a bit on the long side. Will work on the car next week to see if this is the cause of my problems.
Ciao
Jan
Jan Deurinck
Series 1 - 1966 - 2+2 - LHD - American Import
Si vales, bene est, ego valeo

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#33 Re: Ride height - Torsion bars

Post by Maikel » Thu May 03, 2018 2:59 pm

Does anybody recognize this marking on a torsion bar and what size and side it is?

Many many thanks


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