Koni Shocks for my S1
#1 Koni Shocks for my S1
Please could anyone recommend which Koni shocks I should be looking at to uprate the suspension and where to get them?
Regards
Richard
Richard
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#2
Koni Classics are OK (painted black seems to be the only difference from the normal ones) but there have been quality control problems of late. Two of my rears failed at 18,000 miles. I have now replaced the four rears with Spax. The "adjustable" feature on the Koni's is open to debate as you have to take them off the car to make any change to the damper setting. Very few people bother once they are fitted so seems a bit pointless paying for the facility. Indeed most people just leave them at the factory setting.
Spax and GAZ make 'on-car' adjustable shocks but Andrew Turvey at CMC tells me they have stopped fitting them after several failures of the adjusting valve and control knob. If you are going to track day your car then adjustable shocks might be worth considering but otherwise you will be wasting your money and time. Can you really see yourself crawling under the car and adding or removing a few clicks from all six shock absorbers? Go for standard E-Type Girling shocks (correct metallic blue colour) if you can get them or standard Spax. The E-Type handles perfectly with the standard setup so anything you do is probably going to be a compromise.
Spax and GAZ make 'on-car' adjustable shocks but Andrew Turvey at CMC tells me they have stopped fitting them after several failures of the adjusting valve and control knob. If you are going to track day your car then adjustable shocks might be worth considering but otherwise you will be wasting your money and time. Can you really see yourself crawling under the car and adding or removing a few clicks from all six shock absorbers? Go for standard E-Type Girling shocks (correct metallic blue colour) if you can get them or standard Spax. The E-Type handles perfectly with the standard setup so anything you do is probably going to be a compromise.
Last edited by Heuer on Mon Aug 18, 2008 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
David Jones
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
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#3
David, many thanks for the heads-up regarding Koni's quality troubles. I installed Konis on my '65 in 1991 and was going to do the same on my current car. They cost a bloody fortune and having them fail at 18K miles would make me very unhappy. I've seen Boge shocks for E-Types and wonder if anyone has tried them.
Mark (Moe) Shipley
Former owner '66FHC, #1E32208
Former owner '65FHC, #1E30036
Planning on getting E-Type No. 3 as soon as possible....
Former owner '66FHC, #1E32208
Former owner '65FHC, #1E30036
Planning on getting E-Type No. 3 as soon as possible....
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#4 Koni Shocks
Thanks for the reply. I am not looking to do track days I merely want to improve the handling on the car. Would spax be a better choice?
Regards
Richard
Richard
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#5
Richard
It will be very difficult to 'improve' the handling of an E-Type although very easy to 'change' it, not necessarily for the better. The car is, by design, very neutral with a hint of under-steer which can quickly be adjusted by the use of the throttle. With standard springs/shocks and good 185 tyres you should be able to have the time of your life on the open road. Go with standard Spax shocks and, if you have money to spare, a set of Michelin 185 XVS tyres. Tyres are an intrinsic part of the suspension and the Michelin tyres were the best improvement I ever made to my car's handling. Dougal at Longstone Tyres can give you the full story.
It will be very difficult to 'improve' the handling of an E-Type although very easy to 'change' it, not necessarily for the better. The car is, by design, very neutral with a hint of under-steer which can quickly be adjusted by the use of the throttle. With standard springs/shocks and good 185 tyres you should be able to have the time of your life on the open road. Go with standard Spax shocks and, if you have money to spare, a set of Michelin 185 XVS tyres. Tyres are an intrinsic part of the suspension and the Michelin tyres were the best improvement I ever made to my car's handling. Dougal at Longstone Tyres can give you the full story.
David Jones
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
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#6
Hi David
Thanks for the advice, I will talk to Dougal.
Richard
Thanks for the advice, I will talk to Dougal.
Richard
Regards
Richard
Richard
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#7 Standard shocks
Who makes the standard shocks and who sells them?
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#8
David Jones
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
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#9 series one suspension
Richard,
just fyi, I have had new spax shocks and 185 michelin XVS tyres. I had them fitted last July and drove them to Le Mans Classic. It was a revelation. The car truly never drove so great.
hope this helps
cheers
Erik
just fyi, I have had new spax shocks and 185 michelin XVS tyres. I had them fitted last July and drove them to Le Mans Classic. It was a revelation. The car truly never drove so great.
hope this helps
cheers
Erik
Erik Antwerp
1966 S1 4.2 FHC,Belgium
1966 S1 4.2 FHC,Belgium
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#10
For info, I also recommend the XVS tyre having deliberated for some time over whether to spend so much money. The transformation in stability at high speed and precise turning control was greatly improved over my old 10 year+ tyres.
(My standard/basic non-adjustable shocks were not changed the tyres alone made an impressive difference so didn't bother changing serviceable shocks)
John H
(My standard/basic non-adjustable shocks were not changed the tyres alone made an impressive difference so didn't bother changing serviceable shocks)
John H
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#11 Agreed
Hi John,
I have them on my OTS on Borranis. The optimal combination.
I buy a lot from Longstone, and have XWX on about 5 BMW coupes as well as on the 420G and Iso Grifo
They also look very cool and period correct.
I have toyed with the idea of trying the Cinturatos which Pirelli have started to remanufacture. Threads are very thin, so more rubber on the tarmac when dry, but fewer escape routes for the water in rain (but these cars should not be driven in the rain....).
Best,
Peder
I have them on my OTS on Borranis. The optimal combination.
I buy a lot from Longstone, and have XWX on about 5 BMW coupes as well as on the 420G and Iso Grifo
They also look very cool and period correct.
I have toyed with the idea of trying the Cinturatos which Pirelli have started to remanufacture. Threads are very thin, so more rubber on the tarmac when dry, but fewer escape routes for the water in rain (but these cars should not be driven in the rain....).
Best,
Peder
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#12 Koni shocks
I have Boge shocks and am very happy with them (after 5 years and over 30K miles). I like the amount of feel. The ride is very fine. No complaints at all. Since we live close to each other you would be welcome to try my car out and see what you think.Moeregaard wrote:David, many thanks for the heads-up regarding Koni's quality troubles. I installed Konis on my '65 in 1991 and was going to do the same on my current car. They cost a bloody fortune and having them fail at 18K miles would make me very unhappy. I've seen Boge shocks for E-Types and wonder if anyone has tried them.
Larry
Larry Wade
62 OTS 877842
La Canada, California, USA
62 OTS 877842
La Canada, California, USA
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#13
David wrote, that it would be difficult, to improve the handling of an E-type. I don't think so. Watch this. I think you all have seen this ten times.
http://jaguarstypeparts.net/top-gear-as ... rt-2-of-2/
Thes e-type was technically uprated from eagle. It seems, that the improving has worked very well, because this car was quicker than a Mercedes SL 55 AMG on the track.
Which type of shocks eagle is using for their cars ?
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
http://jaguarstypeparts.net/top-gear-as ... rt-2-of-2/
Thes e-type was technically uprated from eagle. It seems, that the improving has worked very well, because this car was quicker than a Mercedes SL 55 AMG on the track.
Which type of shocks eagle is using for their cars ?
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
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#14
I second everything that David said . It seems to escape people's notice that Jaguar really were quite good at designing cars, judging from the fact that on nearly all their models the setup changed very little over the years. The ride/handling compromise on the 6 cylinder Es was astonishing for its time and is still of a very high standard provided the suspension is in good condition . Oh, and as a last point, I would hardly regarded Clarkson as a reliable guide to anyting in the motoring world. Entertaining ? Yes . Authoritative ? Er......No
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#15
Woolfi
The Eagle E-Type is a very well sorted, stunning car but a caricature of the original and to get that sort of performance will cost you upwards of ?200,000. http://www.eaglegb.com/etypes.html?type=roadster They are fantastic to drive but whether you think it is an 'improvement' to a standard car is a matter of personal preference. Classic & Sportscar recently voted the standard E-Type number 6 in its list of 'Best Drivers Car's Ever' so you have to ask if it needs 'improving' or if people are missing something if they do.
The reason it is very difficult to improve on the E-Type's handling is down to the design - it has very poor torsional rigidity because of the bolt on frames. Pressed Steel R&D department measured it at 2,650lb.ft/degree "which is pretty low compared to the average" - full report in Porter's Definitive History of the E-Type book, p251. Wire wheels don't help. What Eagle have done is really a triumph of development over design, a bit like the 911!
To be fair to the SL55 its Top Gear lap was in the wet although it is a bit of a barge anyway.
The Eagle E-Type is a very well sorted, stunning car but a caricature of the original and to get that sort of performance will cost you upwards of ?200,000. http://www.eaglegb.com/etypes.html?type=roadster They are fantastic to drive but whether you think it is an 'improvement' to a standard car is a matter of personal preference. Classic & Sportscar recently voted the standard E-Type number 6 in its list of 'Best Drivers Car's Ever' so you have to ask if it needs 'improving' or if people are missing something if they do.
The reason it is very difficult to improve on the E-Type's handling is down to the design - it has very poor torsional rigidity because of the bolt on frames. Pressed Steel R&D department measured it at 2,650lb.ft/degree "which is pretty low compared to the average" - full report in Porter's Definitive History of the E-Type book, p251. Wire wheels don't help. What Eagle have done is really a triumph of development over design, a bit like the 911!
To be fair to the SL55 its Top Gear lap was in the wet although it is a bit of a barge anyway.
David Jones
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
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#16
I?m wondering what Eagle do to ?transform? the handling of the E Type. I can?t imagine that they do anything to make the body stiffer, or change the fundamentals of the suspension. If that?s so, then it?s only the springs / torsion bars, shocks, anti-roll bar, ride height, bushes, wheels and tyres?pretty standard stuff to play with! And not very expensive in the scheme of things.
Does anybody know the specification they use?
I do agree with David that making a good track car takes away from the normal road ?Jaguar? experience. You just have to compare an ?M? BMW with a Jag XK. The BM is great fun and very involving, but hard work (and hard on the back) after a couple of hundred miles. The XK won?t get around corners in quite the same way, but 800 miles later still feels comfortable. It?s all a matter of trade-off I guess.
Or perhaps I?m just getting old!!
Does anybody know the specification they use?
I do agree with David that making a good track car takes away from the normal road ?Jaguar? experience. You just have to compare an ?M? BMW with a Jag XK. The BM is great fun and very involving, but hard work (and hard on the back) after a couple of hundred miles. The XK won?t get around corners in quite the same way, but 800 miles later still feels comfortable. It?s all a matter of trade-off I guess.
Or perhaps I?m just getting old!!
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#17
If cost is no object you can do quite a lot - alloy IRS cage, alloy trailing arms, coil over shock front suspension, carbon fibre prop shaft (a J D Classics option) etc, etc. But you are still left with that bendy chassis and flexing wire wheels. Trick is to work with that knowledge and try to compensate for the deficiencies. The objective though is to make these cars into something palatable for anyone who is expecting and used to 21st century refinement. No harm in that of course and it brings the E-Type to a different audience.
David Jones
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
1997 Porsche 911 Guards Red
Add your E-Type to our World Map: http://forum.etypeuk.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1810
S1 OTS OSB; S1 FHC ODB
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#18
I agree with MarkE. Maybe the eagle, which we can see in the video, is cornering quick, but very stiff and uncomfortable.
I also think, that Eagle company is not producing tuning parts. They are buying these parts from the producer or dealer like Rob Beere, we all know well, and mount into the car.
If they test a lot with different parts, if they make a lot of effort to develope a better working suspension, it seems possible for me, that the car is a little bit stiffer and more uncomfortable, but driving und braking (much?) better. I think it is the complete package of upgrades, which make the car driving better. Now we are back to the question: which parts eagle is using to improve ?
Next spring I will mount a upgraded anti roll bar to the front and a anti roll bar to the back of my EV12. I hope, that the cornering and the steering will feel more "directly". I will inform.
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
I also think, that Eagle company is not producing tuning parts. They are buying these parts from the producer or dealer like Rob Beere, we all know well, and mount into the car.
If they test a lot with different parts, if they make a lot of effort to develope a better working suspension, it seems possible for me, that the car is a little bit stiffer and more uncomfortable, but driving und braking (much?) better. I think it is the complete package of upgrades, which make the car driving better. Now we are back to the question: which parts eagle is using to improve ?
Next spring I will mount a upgraded anti roll bar to the front and a anti roll bar to the back of my EV12. I hope, that the cornering and the steering will feel more "directly". I will inform.
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
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#19
I have 205/70 R 15 W Pirellis P 6000, adjustable Gaz shock absorbers, an coopercraft 4 pots brakes in my series one 3.8 roadster, and I?m very happy with the handling.
Also the same neumatics, shocks absorbers and brakes in my Mk 2, and also goes fantastic
Regards
Mario
Also the same neumatics, shocks absorbers and brakes in my Mk 2, and also goes fantastic
Regards
Mario
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#20
Maybe with an uprated front anti roll bar and an additional rear anti roll bar the handling would improve ?
The series I had a rear anto roll bar. Later cars had this not. Does anybody know why Jaguars has left this ?
Has somebody mounted uprated anti roll bars in his e-type ? Results for a better cornering ? Drivability ?
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
The series I had a rear anto roll bar. Later cars had this not. Does anybody know why Jaguars has left this ?
Has somebody mounted uprated anti roll bars in his e-type ? Results for a better cornering ? Drivability ?
Regards Wolfgang Gatza
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