Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light.

Talk about the E-Type Series 2

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FHCINSC
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#1 Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light.

Post by FHCINSC » Sat Dec 15, 2018 4:48 pm

Apologies to ask this but as I’m fixing the connections on my S2 LHD tail lights, there is the question of which two functions share the dual filament bulb and which function uses the single bulb? Can’t find it anywhere on the web.

The wiring diagram indicates that the brake light and turn signal share that dual filament bulb...that just didn’t make much sense to me. And then one of John’s videos about Bettie (great videos) John indicates the single filament bulb is for turn signals.

Confused. Thanks for your help.
Anthony


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Last edited by FHCINSC on Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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288gto
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#2 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by 288gto » Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:39 pm

Anthony, I think I'm right in saying that it depends on whether you have American spec rear lights which are all red or Eurooean spec ones which are red and amber.
On a US spec S2 with all red rear lights the turn signal flashes red so the dual filament bulb would be for the brake and turn signal and the single filament for the side lights as shown in your wiring diagram picture. For European cars with an amber turn signal the dual filament is for brake and side lights.

I hope that makes sense.

Simon
Simon
1969 S2 OTS

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#3 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:13 pm

Simon. Blessings to you for that information. That is very helpful. Yes it is a US spec car with all red lens. I don’t suppose this really matters because it will work either way but is the green wire coming out of my light fixture for the brake light or is that for the turn signal?

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Series1 Stu
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#4 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by Series1 Stu » Sat Dec 15, 2018 11:17 pm

Don't forget that turn signal and brake light bulbs need to be 21 Watts and side lights 5 Watts for UK spec cars. So make sure that, if you're going for UK road legal specs then you'll need 21/5 Watt bulbs for stop and tail and 21 Watt single filament behind amber lenses for turn signal lamps.

Regards

Edit: Just realised that you're US based so as you were!
Stuart

If you can't make it work, make it complicated!

'62 FHC - Work In (slow) Progress
'69 Daimler 420 Sovereign
'94 X300 XJR basket case

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#5 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:27 pm

Thanks for everyone’s help. It seems my bonnet pin repro manufacturer has played a cruel joke on me with the numbering on the plugs. Have a look at the pics and think about what happens when you put these plugs together.

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Thanks all
Anthony

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#6 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by Series1 Stu » Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:13 pm

:banghead:

Yep. Perfectly sums up the reproduction parts industry.

:lol:
Stuart

If you can't make it work, make it complicated!

'62 FHC - Work In (slow) Progress
'69 Daimler 420 Sovereign
'94 X300 XJR basket case

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#7 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Tue Dec 18, 2018 12:18 am

And just went to get gas...heard muffler scrape. Found this. I know there is a safety bracket missing but a peice of metal glued to rubber is what someone thought of?
Headed to a muffler shop this week anyway because the headers are too close to the steering shaft. Thanks for letting me vent.

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#8 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by 288gto » Tue Dec 18, 2018 9:28 am

Series1 Stu wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:13 pm
:banghead:

Yep. Perfectly sums up the reproduction parts industry.

:lol:
1 and 4 are right , what more do you want Stu? It's got 8 pins and sockets, it's vaguely round and black. Some of it looks like it might conduct electricity and some looks like an insulating material. Well within repro industry standards and only £80.00, I really can't see what the problem is! :bigrin:

Simon


Anthony,

ref the exhaust mount, it could be worse, it could be the rubber "glued to metal" steering rack mounts or IRS mounts. At least it hopefully hasn't caused any major damage.

Simon
Simon
1969 S2 OTS

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chrisfell
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#9 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by chrisfell » Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:38 am

Other bonded parts delaminating?

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A 2+2 main box bracket hanger.


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Rear suspension hangers.

Our cars were not meant to last this long. This is the result.
Chris '67 S1 2+2

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288gto
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#10 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by 288gto » Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:56 am

chrisfell wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 10:38 am
Other bonded parts delaminating?.......

Our cars were not meant to last this long. This is the result.
After 40 years I can cope with, but after 4 months perhaps the quality of the new parts needs considering? Certainly in Anthony’s pic above the part looks to be a recent replacement as part of the restoration.
I often wonder how the big suppliers go on in terms of liability insurance should one of their components fail causing injury? I know when I spoke to one particular large supplier they said that they were not responsible in any way and basically you fit their part at your own risk.

Simon
Simon
1969 S2 OTS

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Bfastr
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#11 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by Bfastr » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:00 pm

that certainly looks like a new repro part. there has and will continue to be discussion about quality of the new parts coming from China. here is a picture of a repro motor mount after one year. some will say they must have sold me a fender mount instead of a motor mount etc, but they still sold it as a motor mount.


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Bob F

69 S2 E-type OTS LHD

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#12 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by christopher storey » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:01 pm

Simon : whoever was telling you that tale needs to take legal advice a.s.a.p . There is absolutely no exemption from liability in respect of a part which is defective by reason of negligence in its design or manufacture , and if they think they can exempt themselves in respect of personal injury by terms in the contract of sale , they are wrong !

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#13 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by Series1 Stu » Tue Dec 18, 2018 8:38 pm

Don't blame the Chinese manufacturers for these problems. They make what they are asked for, which is usually something as cheap as possible. I have had lots of things made in China and they're good as long as you know what is required and how to achieve it. I believe that is where the specialists get it wrong. They don't really know how to get it right.

Regards
Stuart

If you can't make it work, make it complicated!

'62 FHC - Work In (slow) Progress
'69 Daimler 420 Sovereign
'94 X300 XJR basket case

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#14 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Sat Dec 22, 2018 7:54 pm

Agree with much of the below but I found the receipt for the bonnet harness and it was 2 parts totaling $800!

I haven’t had classic cars since the late 90s and back then it was usually frowned upon to have a modified classic. For example the Porsche 356 Outlaw cars were looked down upon. But as I am getting back into the classics now I am seeing a change of that ideal. Perhaps it is the existence of poor reproduction parts that is bringing a change in mindset on keeping a car totally stock.
For me, I’ll be looking for parts that will make my car reliable and I don’t care if that disqualifies me from showing the car.

288gto wrote:
Tue Dec 18, 2018 9:28 am
Series1 Stu wrote:
Mon Dec 17, 2018 11:13 pm
:banghead:

Yep. Perfectly sums up the reproduction parts industry.

:lol:
1 and 4 are right , what more do you want Stu? It's got 8 pins and sockets, it's vaguely round and black. Some of it looks like it might conduct electricity and some looks like an insulating material. Well within repro industry standards and only £80.00, I really can't see what the problem is! :bigrin:

Simon


Anthony,

ref the exhaust mount, it could be worse, it could be the rubber "glued to metal" steering rack mounts or IRS mounts. At least it hopefully hasn't caused any major damage.

Simon

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#15 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:28 pm

Ok. Lighting situation is still not quite right.
Here is a video showing the these behaviors:
1.Brake lights working (is the correct part of the lens being lit?)
2.Turn signal working (correct part of the lens lit?)
3.Tail lights (not working)
4.Tail lights and brake (only brake working)
5.Hazard on (hazard not flashing)

Thoughts welcome!
Thanks
Anthony

[BBvideo=]
[/BBvideo]

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johnetype
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#16 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by johnetype » Wed Jan 09, 2019 8:33 pm

The side light/tail light all use 5w filaments and they are connected to the red wire. In a S2 rear light cluster there is only one 5w filament and it's the one with the 21w filament together in one bulb. The 21w filament is the brake light (GP wire).
That leaves the indicator bulb as a single 21w filament in its own bulb, GW or GR wire.
US or UK, there is no difference between the S2 rear light cluster base unit and they are both wired up the same way so the wiring diagram in post #1 is incorrect.
The only difference between US and UK is the rear light cluster lens where over the indicator the UK version is coloured orange and the US red.
John

1969 Series 2 FHC

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#17 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by 288gto » Wed Jan 09, 2019 10:42 pm

I’m not sure that’s right John. The bases are different for US and UK cars and the wiring diagram would be right for a US car.
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Simon
1969 S2 OTS

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#18 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by johnetype » Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:28 am

The bases weren't different on my '69 car. With all the LHD to RHD conversions going on, it'll be interesting to know who had a base fitted like the one in the bottom of your picture.
John

1969 Series 2 FHC

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#19 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by 288gto » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:36 am

Hi John, from the S2 parts catalogue. My 69 car had the ones in the bottom picture and I’ve seen quite a few US cars with that set up. Perhaps it depended on a change in US lighting regulations? I’ll see if there is anything relating to chassis number or date.

UK spec part number C33592
US spec twin reflector part number C30882
US spec single reflector. part number C35130

Simon
Simon
1969 S2 OTS

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#20 Re: Turn Signal/Brake Light/Side Light...dumb question

Post by FHCINSC » Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:31 pm

Why would the red wire that eventually goes to the side lights connect to the dash panel light switch? I would think it would connect to the side light switch?

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Thanks
Anthony

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