Auto to Manual

Talk about the E-Type Series 3
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andrewh
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#1 Auto to Manual

Post by andrewh » Thu May 31, 2018 7:47 pm

My efforts to find the right Series 3 have now moved onto the possibility of buying an Auto and converting it to a manual. So given that there is a reasonable discount on autos to manuals, and in any event a 5 speed would be an attractive proposition, I wonder whether anyone has carried out this conversion and how tricky it is. Can one source the pedal box and other vital parts? Is the crank the same and just a matter of changing out the auto for a manual ? Anyway, hopefully the experts will be along just now to put me right. Thanks in advance. Andrew
1962 3.8 Series One FHC

http://etype860897.blogspot.com/

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E-typeguy
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#2 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by E-typeguy » Thu May 31, 2018 8:06 pm

Hi Andrew,

I am converting a "Auto to Manual" as well ...although to a stock 4 speed. So far parts acquisition has been ok. I was able to source alot of the drive train parts from a fellow forum member - Thanks again Pete !! :salute:
My only real issue has been finding a stock manual gearbox sheet metal tunnel cover. Others have informed me that the repro parts lack "in fit". I'm sure with a little effort and patience you can accomplish this.

All the best,
Wes
1972 Jaguar XKE coupe - Series III

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angelw
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#3 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by angelw » Thu May 31, 2018 9:29 pm

Andrew Wrote:
Can one source the pedal box and other vital parts? Is the crank the same and just a matter of changing out the auto for a manual ? Anyway, hopefully the experts will be along just now to put me right. Thanks in advance.
Hello Andrew,
As Wes states, all the parts required are readily available. The Pedal Box is not an issue, as its the same part for Auto and Manual, as well as being the same for LHD and RHD; all you need to do is add the Clutch Pedal.

Regards,

Bill

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#4 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by JJC » Fri Jun 01, 2018 6:49 am

Here is a thought. Learn to love the automatic Series 3. I have had a 1973 OTS since new, 4 speed, now a 5 speed (best thing I ever did to the car), and I still enjoy the heck out of my beautiful E. But recently, I drove a friends 1973 OTS Automatic, and I must say, it was a blast !! That silky smooth 12, mated to an equally smooth automatic.....well, I just loved it. What a pleasure.....different from the manual, but just as enjoyable, in its own way. If you find a good condition Series 3 automatic, I would suggest driving it for some time, before you make the conversion, which is never easy, lots of work and frustration, and, one day, you might catch yourself stuck in traffic, and you might actually wish you had kept the automatic !! My two cents. Best of luck !

John

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#5 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by andrewh » Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:13 am

Thanks John, and of course sound words. The thing is I have an XJ12 Series One ( auto ) and a very early XJS, which is also Auto and both run the BW box. I find old auto boxes very dated against the auto boxes of today. I know thats not the point, but with just 3 gears it really doesn't make the most of the V12 power unit and I think one of the ways to make the Series 3 more of a sports drive could well be to have a manual. I will try to drive one as you say, but think its really got to be a manual for me. thanks for the reply though Andrew
1962 3.8 Series One FHC

http://etype860897.blogspot.com/

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#6 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by Ole-xke1974 » Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:23 am

Hi Andrew,

Here's a list of items to address that I made a while ago after doing my conversion:

Bell housing including clutch release arm and all bits.
  • Clutch master and slave cylinder
    Hydraulic hose or original connection from master to slave.
    Flywheel (I chose s Fidanza)
    Flywheel bolts (longer than the flexplate bolts)
    Complete clutch including release bearing and bolts
    A clutch pedal (make sure you check distances between pedals before final installation. I have pictures)
    Modify auto brake pedal (from wide auto brake pedal to narrow version)
    Brake and clutch pedal rubbers
    Gear box cover from and E-type or modified to place gear stick in original position.
    Gearbox tunnel cover for manual gearbox (Fiber version from SNG)
    Interior transmission tunnel center console
    Overdrive electrical control system (a simple switch or an electronic fool proof system)
A couple of things to consider:
  • If no proof of recent rebuild of gearbox and overdrive, have it done.
    Have your prop shaft balanced
    You are most likely to catch the virus "while I'm in here, I might as well do ......."
I hope this helps ......... Ole
1974 SIII E-Type w. XJ S2 4sp w. O/D

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jagwit
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#7 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by jagwit » Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:56 pm

Ole-xke1974 wrote:
Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:23 am
Here's a list of items to address that I made a while ago after doing my conversion:
Is a spigot bush not needed? Are they installed even for auto?
Best Regards
Philip
71 E-type V12 Coupe,
80 XJS (EFI by Megasquirt & EDIS-6 + 5sp manual overdrive)
73 Jensen Interceptor
74 Interceptor (EFI by Megasquirt + overdrive 4sp auto)

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#8 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by andrewh » Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:58 pm

thanks Ole, thats a pretty thorough list and from the looks of it, there is nothing that is not sortable . I have to look into the availability for a clutch pedal which would seem the only tricking part to find. I agree on the prop shaft. I always fit new high quality props as it saves so much aggravation later on!
1962 3.8 Series One FHC

http://etype860897.blogspot.com/

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JJC
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#9 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by JJC » Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:37 pm

On the subject of driveshafts,once removed, have it shortened by about 3 inches, with a new collapsible section installed. It makes it much easier with in and out's with the gearbox, as engine will not have to be removed. All driveshaft shops will balance and repaint. Don;t need a new one. Good luck !

John

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Ole-xke1974
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#10 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by Ole-xke1974 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 2:57 pm

jagwit wrote:
Fri Jun 01, 2018 12:56 pm
Ole-xke1974 wrote:
Fri Jun 01, 2018 10:23 am
Here's a list of items to address that I made a while ago after doing my conversion:
Is a spigot bush not needed? Are they installed even for auto?
Absolutely YES !
There was no bush installed when I took the auto box out, but installed one for the manual box.

Thanks for pointing that out.
1974 SIII E-Type w. XJ S2 4sp w. O/D

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#11 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by Ole-xke1974 » Sat Jun 02, 2018 3:04 pm

andrewh wrote:
Fri Jun 01, 2018 3:58 pm
thanks Ole, thats a pretty thorough list and from the looks of it, there is nothing that is not sortable . I have to look into the availability for a clutch pedal which would seem the only tricking part to find. I agree on the prop shaft. I always fit new high quality props as it saves so much aggravation later on!
When I bought my gearbox I also got a clutch pedal. Not an original, but made from heavy gauge steel. I then drilled out the "pipe" where the pedal box rod goes through and installed a bronze sleeve.
1974 SIII E-Type w. XJ S2 4sp w. O/D

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vee12eman
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#12 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by vee12eman » Sat Jun 02, 2018 10:53 pm

Hi Andrew,

This subject was covered quite recently:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=11842

I put an answer there so I won’t repeat it. I stress again the bell housing is the big issue since so few V12 cars have were fitted wit manuals - only E-types a tiny number of early XJS and some rather more exotic later TWR etc. models.

Some have mentioned the clutch pedal above. I sourced mine from Richard Smith, both arm and pedal. I got a return spring from one of the usuals, probably SNG, whilst I modified and re-used the brake pedal from the auto, bending it slightly for clearance and cutting down the originator pedal to size. I also re-used all the spacers of the pivot shaft, which I simply cut down as required.

It might seem tight, especially on an E-type forum where we are all seemingly cashed up, but I was on a tight budget and saving money wherever I could. I hunted for the pedal for a long time, the Richard Smith solution was always available, but seemed a bit expensive at the time - re-using the other part re-established my stingy sense of economics!

As for the tunnel cover, many complain about the replacement glass fibre offerings. Once again I was on an economy drive, so I converted my auto cover by cutting and welding. Because I used the Getrag with a home made linkage, I tailored the tunnel to fit that, rather than replicate the original design, but it fits well. I seem to remember using the rubber gaiter from a six cylinder model, which appeared better suited to the very wide Getrag gate. The whole thing fits well with no draughts and I covered it with sound and head deadening, similar to Dynamat, both inside and out. I couldn’t find the original sound deadening material from the car and so didn’t bother. I found it later and decided I would have had to cut it to suit my new linkage, so I didn’t bother and I have found the results pleasing, not noisy and minimal heat transfer.

I have some pictures of the conversion, not many, but send a pm if you want them, I no longer have a hosting arrangement since the Photof**ket debacle.

Incidentally, I did my entire conversion for less than £1000. Admittedly I got lucky finding a gearbox, flywheel, clutch slave cylinder, cover and plate, plus a special bell housing on eBay for £700, but they are out there.

Edit: there are some V12 bell housing options on this page:

http://dellowconversions.com.au/product ... gs-manual/

Regards,

Simon
Simon S-Y
Series III FHC

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andrewh
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#13 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by andrewh » Mon Jun 04, 2018 4:03 am

Thanks very much for such a detailed reply and the links. Nobody has mentioned the gearbox mounting bracket. Is this the same on auto and manual and if not are the threads in the chassis rails already there can we say ? I had not focussed on the bell housing as being a problem but now you mention it I suppose there will be a shortage . Will go and read the other links now. PM sent. Thanks again chaps
1962 3.8 Series One FHC

http://etype860897.blogspot.com/

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MarekH
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#14 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by MarekH » Mon Jun 04, 2018 5:10 am

The gearbox rear mount is in the same place as on the autobox so all of the parts can be reused. The rubbers may be perished by now. The spring may be weaker, but a similar item was used on the XJS.

The fibreglass tunnel cover is mostly ok. Just trial fit it and where it doesn't mate with the front of the bulkhead, break it and reglue it - that's the beauty of fibreglass. Whilst you are there, cut an inspection hole for the clutch slav4e cylinder into the bottom front right corner of the fibrglass cover and cover it with a metal patch. It makes bleeding the clutch much easier.

If using a Jag box, the only "gotcha" with the gearbox is that it has to have the two bosses on the right hand side for the clutch master.

kind regards
Marek

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#15 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by vee12eman » Mon Jun 04, 2018 9:05 am

Hi again,

The gearbox rear mount was one of those things missing entirely on my car; bought incomplete and in boxes. I sourced a second hand unit and fitted the spring for the manual box. There is a huge weight difference between the Auto and Getrag, so the manual mounting spring (C12299) was chosen over the auto version (C19988). All other mounting parts were the same and the gearbox rides very nicely. New rubbers were used.

Regards,

Simon
Simon S-Y
Series III FHC

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#16 Re: Auto to Manual

Post by andrewh » Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:08 pm

thank you Chaps. I was thinking of the E type fabs 5 speed which I am hoping would come with a bell housing . Just waiting on that at present. All good stuff, I fancy a new project!
1962 3.8 Series One FHC

http://etype860897.blogspot.com/

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