Steering rack series 3

Talk about the E-Type Series 3

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flyer295
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#1 Steering rack series 3

Post by flyer295 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:39 am

I have a problem with the pinion in the steering rack and a specialist firm has informed me that it's not mendable as the pinion is no longer made.
I have heard that a FORD (Agh!) rack can be used, but which one ?
Anyone any ideas ?
Bob.

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Bob.
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#2 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by Bob. » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:38 am

H Bob,
Since what I understand is the LHD Mondeo based rack conversion became available, I know a number of LHD to RHD conversions have been done using it so there must be old LHD racks around from which you could use the pinion. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think the pinion is unique to the S3 E unfortunately.
I think it was Vicarage who came up with the Ford based conversion but they, SNGB and CMC all sell the kit although some people have had problems with wrongly formed mounting plates and you do end up with solid rack mounts and possibly a worse turning circle although you would need to check that.
eg https://www.sngbarratt.com/uk/#!/Englis ... caa9f48b96
Hope this helps,
Bob
Bob
'71 S3

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flyer295
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#3 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by flyer295 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 8:55 am

This rack is a RHD one. It's just that the pinion is damaged
Bob.

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angelw
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#4 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by angelw » Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:09 am

Bob Wrote:
Since what I understand is the LHD Mondeo based rack conversion became available, I know a number of LHD to RHD conversions have been done using it so there must be old LHD racks around from which you could use the pinion. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think the pinion is unique to the S3 E unfortunately.
Hello Bob,
The Pinion Gear used in an S3 E Type is a straight cut spur gear, whilst the Pinion Gear of a Mondeo, XJ6 etc. is a Helical Gear, and therefore can't be interchanged with an S3 Pinion.

The Pinion Tower of a Series 3 E Type is mounted perpendicular to the Rack Bar and is done so to give a good line of sight from the Pinion to the Steering Column Shaft and better clearance with the Engine Frame and other components in the vicinity.

I've not had to install an alternate Power Steering Rack to an S3 E Type, when converting a LHD to RHD, as I manufacture the required parts in house to complete the conversion. But I'm surprised that any Rack Assembly where the Pinion Tower is mounted other than perpendicular wouldn't have clearance, or unreasonable alignment issues.

Regards,

Bill

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#5 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by Bob. » Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:52 am

Hi Bill,
Sorry, I didn't mean that you could use a Mondeo pinion, only a good used pinion from a discarded LHD S3 rack which might be available where an owner had changed to RHD using the complete Ford based rack conversion. Hope I haven't muddied the water.
This is a picture from above of a car with the conversion and it certainly shows a more compromised alignment than the original arrangement.
Bob
Image
Bob
'71 S3

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#6 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by angelw » Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:44 am

Bob Wrote:
it certainly shows a more compromised alignment than the original arrangement.
Hello Bob,
That's why, without actually having installed one of the alternatives, that I wouldn't like to be doing such a conversion.

The only part of the original S3 PAS Rack assembly that is not ambidextrous is the aluminum housing that the Pinion Tower attaches to. I have these cast as per original specification and machine them using CNC machine tools. Following is the Initial Casting prior to machining:

Image

A LHD Pinion Tower can be used on the RH Side, but instead of the pipe connections of the Pinion Tower pointing towards 5 o'clock (as they would with a correct RHD unit), they point towards 2 o'clock. This is not much of an issue, as custom tubing is easy to make and the whole system looks like it belongs.

I also make RHD Pinion Towers, but most choose the cheaper option of using their original LHD Pinion Tower with custom tubing.

To flyer295
An S3 Pinion Shaft is not a complicated part; you could have it made.

Regards,

Bill

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flyer295
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#7 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by flyer295 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:22 pm

It is the inside of the tower that's damaged.

Know anyone who has an old LHD one as that part is not handed
Bob.

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#8 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by angelw » Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:42 pm

Bob Wrote:
It is the inside of the tower that's damaged.

Know anyone who has an old LHD one as that part is not handed
Hello Bob,
The Pinion Tower is handed. A correct RHD (for an S3) Pinion Tower has the pipe connection face pointing towards 5 o'clock. A LHD Pinion Tower installed on a RHD PAS Rack Assembly, will have the pipe connection face pointing towards 2 o'clock and will require a custom set of hydraulic tubes.

In what way is it damage? I've re-sleeved many before. However, if its beyond repair, I can supply either a LHD, or correct RHD Pinion Tower. Alternatively, I believe I can put you in touch with someone in the UK that may have one. I'll ask him first before I commit him to helping. In any case, there will be a Pinion Tower available.

Regards,

Bill

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flyer295
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#9 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by flyer295 » Tue Jul 23, 2019 3:22 pm

Hello Bill,
I didn't think they were handed.
I had to remove the pinch bolt on the CV joint with a grinder, not realising that it was hollow. I inadvertently went slightly too deep and went through into the shaft. I tried welding it but the specialist I took it to said when he tried drawing out the torque shaft it scores the tower in the inside.
I think the torque shaft is salvageable but the tower was scored when removing it by a small amount of weld. By welding it I also damaged the 'O' ring. necessitating the torque shafts removal.
You say you can supply one of these, if so how much and hoe long to do.
Regards,

Bob
Bob.

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Nick V12 e type
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#10 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by Nick V12 e type » Tue Jul 23, 2019 9:48 pm

Hi Bob,

I found Kiley & Clinton in Birmingham to be very helpful, I called in to see them to discuss switching my rack from LHD to RHD. I will return to them when I’m ready to fit the rack.

I was afforded lots of time and guidance an was invited in for a chat at a time when I expect they would have been heading home.

I have not used their service yet and have no affiliation or interest.

Nick
e type series 3 V12 2+2 1972, Tesla Model S 2016

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tim wood
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#11 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by tim wood » Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:09 pm

another vote for Kiley Clinton. I've used them and they did a 1st class jab at reasonable cost & turn round time. I believe some of the major restorers also use them
Series 1 FHC purchased 40 years ago. Courted my wife in it.
Series 1 2+2 when the kids were small now sold.
Series 1.5 OTS in opalescent maroon, Californian car. My retirement present.

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71 V12
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#12 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by 71 V12 » Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:19 pm

And another vote for Killy Clinton. I believe they manufacture the Mondeo based conversion kit for SNGB and the others.

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paustin
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#13 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by paustin » Thu Jul 25, 2019 3:26 pm

Hi Bob, I sourced from Vicarage a couple of years ago a rack and pinion ( kit ) which is a Ford product. I am more than happy with the conversion which gives a better weighted feel and less turns lock to lock. Also as a far more modern product, I've confidence that over time leaks are far less likely.

Phil

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#14 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by hazzardv12 » Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:07 pm

I've got a 42000 miles lhd series three rack I don't need .(rhd conversion).Any use ?
John Hazzard, Series3 2+2 , import but RHD Conversion with modern pas,5 speed conversion and fuel injection, plus DB7 Vantage and turbocharged Jensen Healey !

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#15 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by lowact » Wed Jan 08, 2020 5:23 am

angelw wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 1:42 pm
t
A LHD Pinion Tower installed on a RHD PAS Rack Assembly, will have the pipe connection face pointing towards 2 o'clock and will require a custom set of hydraulic tubes.
Hello Bill. Pinion has 3 (equilateral) mounting bolts so I'm seeing options are 2, 6 and 10 o'clock? Is 2 o'clock just to match the original look (as much as possible)? Any reason why I shouldn't choose 10 o'clock? I'm seeing that, if 10 o'clock, hydraulic lines could be shorter and less convoluted?
Regards,
ColinL
'72 OTS manual V12

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#16 Re: Steering rack series 3

Post by angelw » Wed Jan 08, 2020 7:27 am

Colin Wrote:
Pinion has 3 (equilateral) mounting bolts so I'm seeing options are 2, 6 and 10 o'clock? Is 2 o'clock just to match the original look (as much as possible)? Any reason why I shouldn't choose 10 o'clock? I'm seeing that, if 10 o'clock, hydraulic lines could be shorter and less convoluted?
Hello Colin,
Yes, 2 o'clock is only for looks and then only if you squint. !0 o'clock would be a good alternative.

Regards,

Bill

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