Values

Simon P · Post by **Simon P** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 10:35 am

Here's an interesting comparison from the Gooding & Company auction in the States that Andrew H's earlier post referred to.

$418,000, and firmly within the estimated range, for a car with flat floors, welded louvres and OBLs:

http://www.goodingco.com/vehicle/1961-j ... oadster-4/

On the other hand, $192,500, and failing to make the estimated range, for ostensibly the same car but without the OBLs:

http://www.goodingco.com/vehicle/1962-j ... -roadster/

That's an awful lot of a premium to pay for a couple of old-fashioned bolts from the ironmonger's store!

On the other hand you could have had a Series 1.5 with all the problems of the early cars sorted out for just under $50k, leaving you with an awfully big budget with which to make it pristine again and find something else to keep it company in your garage....

http://www.goodingco.com/vehicle/1968-j ... tre-coupe/

David Oslo · Post by **David Oslo** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 12:38 pm

Mark Gordon wrote: he said, "I'll give you $60,000 cash for it right now."

Sounds like Richard Rawlins from Fast and Loud (TV program).

I would be a bit worried why someone is literally driving around with 60 grand in their pocket...... And even more worried when it get's upped to 100 grand.....worried that I might end up in the trunk (boot) of their car after I'd signed over the registration and handed over the keys.

Best to engage first gear and floor it !

Mark Gordon · Post by **Mark Gordon** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 3:39 pm

I doubt that he had the cash on him but it didn't matter because I wasn't in the mood to sell. Last summer, someone stopped by the house, saw (I presume) the E Type in the garage and asked my son who was out front how much I wanted for the Jaguar. I told him to tell the guy it wasn't for sale, but maybe I should have thrown a ridiculous number out there. It later occurred to me that I should have asked him, "which one?" as the VDP was sitting in the driveway.

MarkE · Post by **MarkE** » Tue Mar 17, 2015 4:15 pm

Isn't it interesting how we get a bit excited at the thought of an E Type dropping in value, yet seem to not worry about the near vertical cliff that is new car depreciation!

Buy a mid-top of the range Mercedes, Jaguar, Audi, Range Rover or BMW for ?80k, and it's value drops by ?20k before you get it home. After 2 years you've lost ?40k, and at 5 years ?60k.

Even with a massive movement in the classic car market I can't see anything like that sort of change.

I can also see a couple of big differences in the market between 1989 and now not mentioned yet.

Firstly, the quality of the market 'stock' has risen considerably. As mentioned above, there are many more cars that have been restored to a high professional standard, whereas in 1989 that level of restoration was pretty unusual. Worse, many Ferraris, Astons and E Types were given rapid makeovers in the late 1980s to make a quick profit out of the sudden interest in some classics. The trade knew it, the auctioneers knew it, and the marque enthusiasts knew it, and the market suddenly had a lot of very poorly restored cars that nobody wanted, as they were essentially for restoration....again.

Secondly, we are right about in the middle of the demand for cars like the E Type. Who, growing up in the UK in the late 50s and the 60s, didn't want an E type, or a DB5, a Cooper 'S', a Healey 3000, an Elan or Lotus Cortina? Those young lads are now aged 50 - 70 plus, and quite a few are lucky enough to have the health, time and money to indulge.

It may all be different in 20 years time when many of us baby boomers can't get into an old car let alone drive one, and the average modern car is doing 150mpg, but right now, I can't really see demand dropping off as it did in 1990.

Perhaps some of the hysteria taken out of the market may be a good thing, and 'normal' restored cars could well go back to the sort of values we were happy with 3 or 4 years ago. But I'll bet that the demand for the the rare models, the perfectly restored and super-original, and the cars with exceptional provenance will still be very strong.

I guess that the main impact would be on the project cars and those needing a fair bit of work.

johnben · Post by **johnben** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:10 am

'E-Type Jaguars have tripled in price in three years'

Though this article is from June last year, the same thing was stated last night in what to do with your pension pot. As my insurance renewal date is
next month I will update the value of the car as foolishly the value insured is that when I took out the policy 10 years ago and if it is stolen I am not going to get much of an E Type for ?16000.

John

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/cars ... uyers.html

mystery type · Post by **mystery type** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 3:42 pm

if it is stolen I am not going to get much of an E Type for ?16000.

i am the same john, but if it was stolen, would they pay the current market value or ?16k ?

MarkE · Post by **MarkE** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 3:57 pm

If you have an agreed value policy they will pay that agreed value. I had an email from Hagerty, my insurers, last year, telling me to review the insured value of my cars as the market had moved so much. I think it's worth spending a few minutes doing just that!

Dave K · Post by **Dave K** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:57 pm

I had my flat floor OTS valued by the JEC this year and will be insuring it in June for the amount quoted by the JEC.
No need at the moment as its at work behind a 7500 volt electric fence with 49 CCTV cameras monitoring anyone stupid enough to try and enter site.

Graham Searle told me that if the car was stolen how much would you have to pay to replace it with the same model to the same standard. Made sense to me.

Dave

andrewh · Post by **andrewh** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:35 pm

I don't go with most of what thiis chap says but thought this would be relevant.

https://grrc.goodwood.com/road/news/edw ... rgZUJEK.97

Post by **mgcjag** » Fri Mar 27, 2015 8:36 pm

HI Dave What about it not being insured for its full value against fire or other damage, what about someone driving into it when the gates are open, sods law if u think its safe just against intruders just becaus u have big gates.....get it insured.......Steve

vipergts · Post by **vipergts** » Sat Mar 28, 2015 9:20 am

I have a great insurance company who basically wrote the policy for me to include everything I wanted

Basically I tell them the values of the cars and they write that value as a guaranteed payment plus any movement in the 12 months.

Dave K · Post by **Dave K** » Sat Mar 28, 2015 3:42 pm

mgcjag wrote:HI Dave What about it not being insured for its full value against fire or other damage, what about someone driving into it when the gates are open, sods law if u think its safe just against intruders just becaus u have big gates.....get it insured.......Steve

There are 4 of us onsite, the car is in a heated locked garage and I have the key. Its well away from any machinery and the guys on site know better than to go anywhere near it, if they do have to go in there they ask me to go with them.
We have heat, smoke and gas detectors in every building and all equipment used on site is protected by IS barriers, that means there is not enough energy to create a spark.
If there is a safer place available I have yet to hear about it, well other than a vault.

Dave

malcolm · Post by **malcolm** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 9:30 am

Sounds good, but things do self-ignite. Mouse chews half-way through a cable? Short? I'd insure for full value anyway. Just in case. Not expensive.

MarkE · Post by **MarkE** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:25 am

Having had Lotus Elans for many years I always disconnect the battery of old cars when they are parked up in the garage. Elans are famous for self-ignition, but I have seen a Mk2 Jaguar and a Dino do the same.

The E Type ammeter always worries me!

paulsco · Post by **paulsco** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:34 am

I use a battery isolation connector on my battery terminal; just undo it a little and no circuit.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/12133199 ... 0&ff14=108

Paul

Simon P · Post by **Simon P** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 12:04 pm

Me too. Such a simple effective device I don't understand why not more people fit them. I've got one on my E-type and had one on my Fulvia before that.

Dave K · Post by **Dave K** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 12:18 pm

paulsco wrote:I use a battery isolation connector on my battery terminal; just undo it a little and no circuit.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/12133199 ... 0&ff14=108

Paul

Good idea I've bought 3 of them, one for the E-Type and one for each of the mini's, good anti theft device as well.

Dave

kingzetts · Post by **kingzetts** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:46 pm

If you have a tracking device fitted and intend to fit/use a batttery isolator, make sure you know what impact this will have on the tracking device.

Some devices have non-rechargeable internal backup batteries and disconnecting the car battery will exhaust these, at which point you may have to have the unit replaced to remain insured.

Others have nominally rechargeable internal batteries but these eventually get tired and don't like being called upon.

Some devices will send an alert if power is cut or the batteries run out, some will not.

If in doubt check with the tracking device supplier/installer.

You can of course use isolators with a bypass wire including a low-capacity fuse which will blow if an attempt is made to start the car but will continue to feed low power uses like the clock and tracker etc, but this may defeat the object if you are doing it to avoid any shorts.

ALAN COCHRANE · Post by **ALAN COCHRANE** » Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:19 pm

Dave

If you're after a Tracking Device, the TRACKER is the way to go. They do a version for classic cars that is purely battery powered and guaranteed for five years. The TRACKER company contacted me recently because the transponder was not communicating regularly enough. They replaced the whole unit free of charge.
Unlike the mainstream tracker it is not wired into the car's loom and if the worst happens it relies on you phoning them to start the ball rolling.
This unit is especially suited to cars that may have their battery disconnected for extended periods.
They state in the their blurb that it doesn't just rely on GPS so can be located even if your car is parked in a metal container or an underground car park.
It's not cheap-?299 for five years, but not much when compared to the value of an E-Type.

Cheers

Alan

richard btype · Post by **richard btype** » Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:36 pm

It would be interesting to see whether my hunch is correct with others experience.

There appear to be two distinct markets to me, the investor and the enthusiast.

The investor can be 'sold to' so those companies with extensive facilities, expensive show rooms, and restoration shops will attract those who want a safe purchase with little fuss and not too bothered by an extra nought or so.

They may have little or no knowledge but like wine and art seek out where to put their excess cash for the purposes of an increase in value. Because their research or those reaching the ear or their sensitive noses are advising them of the current growths in the market.

The enthusiast is buying for a different reason and may well ask, why do I want a fully concourse vehicle when really I could have something usable that does not worry me every time its taken out.

Possibly also the enthusiast may not have a huge disposable income but none the less their life is enhanced by having those things that provide satisfaction and pleasure not necessarily of a monetary kind.

The highest values therefore will never be of importance to the enthusiast because there will always exist cars of a lower value that will adequately do what the enthusiast requires.

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Values

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