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#1 new hood

Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 4:38 pm
by max-it-out
The hood on my car is some kind of plastic/vinyl and an ivory-white colour.It has a fair bit of discolouration and a few black scrape marks where it catches in the hood frame.On the one hand it has a certain patina which makes the car more interesting but , on the other hand many people would say it just looks tatty.

So , is vinyl or fabric ( mohair ) better ?
What was the original hood made of ?
Or, would it be possible to paint the hood black ?

Any comments appreciated.

#2 Re: new hood

Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 4:59 pm
by gehawe
A picture would help us to get the complete .. err .. picture.

I personally like fabric more - Sonnenland is the magic word.

#3 Re: new hood

Posted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:38 pm
by Heuer
The S2/3 cars had vinyl hoods made from Everflex. From our Factory Fit thread:

Everflex is the registered trademark of a vinyl fabric used as roof covering on hardtops and convertibles. It was popular from the 1960s to the 1980s on luxury cars though its use has decreased in recent years. On hardtop vehicles a fabric is placed below the Everflex material to add definition and make the car look more like a genuine convertible. The Everflex is then glued down and screwed in around doors and windows. Rolls-Royce, Bentley and Jaguar were the main users. It was particularly popular on the Rolls-Royce Silver Shadow in the early 1970s. Everflexwas used for the hood bags on the very early cars after USA owner complaints of the Twillfast material fading in the sun and later used for the hood material on export cars for the same reason. It became standard on the S2 and S3. It was originally manufactured by Bernard Wardle (Everflex) Ltd and is still manufactured by Wardle Store.

The S1 cars used mohair cloth but this was changed to Everflex after complaints of fading from USA owners.

Mohair is a silk-like fabric or yarn made from the hair of the Angora goat. Both durable and resilient, mohair is notable for its high lustre, sheen and cost! It has nothing to do with the hood material used on an E-Type which is typically made from fine polyester yarn and cotton with a synthetic rubber interply. The term "Mohair" has become more like a brand name over the years. True Mohair, which used to be made from Goats hair, hasn't actually been produced for many, many years. Most manufacturers offering "Mohair" actually produce the hoods using Twillfast which is a very close and modern representation of the original "Mohair" fabric.

#4 Re: new hood

Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2019 2:12 pm
by max-it-out
My first ever Jag ( Daimler Sovereign 4.2 ) had a black vinyl roof - I suppose that would have been " Everflex " also.I`ll probably go with the fabric type for the replacement , as they do look better quality than the vinyl.

Havn`t been out in the rain or washed it , but I suspect the present hood will leak like a sieve looking at the rubber seal :thumbdown:



#5 Re: new hood

Posted: Fri Nov 08, 2019 4:52 pm
by Woolfi
"So , is vinyl or fabric ( mohair ) better ?"
Both have often low quality. If soft-top material is called "mohair", you don't know which producer it has produced. I have seen an E-type top from UK made of "mohair", which became longer/softer and longer/softer evry week. It was realy sh . .
"What was the original hood made of ?"
Everflex or a fabric.
"Or, would it be possible to paint the hood black ?"
If it is a fabric, you can paint it. But the piant will make the fabric stiff and it will break soon.

The high quality materials for soft-tops are comming ONLY (!) from USA and Germany .The name of the company in USA is Haartz. They are producing Haartz 'Twill-fast' and 'Stay-fast'. Both used in the car industry.
The company in Germany was Rhode & Schwalenberg, which was bought from US producer Haartz roundabout 15 - 20 years ago. The high class fabric from Germany is called "Sonnenland-A5 and "Sonnenland-classic". Very similar to Twill-fast and Stay-fast.
Sonnnenland-A5 is very strong and used for modern very quick cars. It is lastig longer, but too stiff and strong for the most oldtimer-tops. The shape of modern tops is with much less curves and more straight. The iron frames ar very stiff.
Sonnenland-Classic is good for the most Oldtimer cars. It is softer and more elastic.
The tops for the e-type MUST (!!!) be produced with Sonneland-Classic or 'stay-fast'. Otherwise the strong top can destroy the iron frame, the window frame and the glas window.
What fabric you believe Porsche, Mercedes, Audi of BMW are using ? Low quality materials like Everflex or "mohair" ? If you produce a low quality fabric you call it "mohair". If you buy a top made of 'mohair", you never know which quality the fabric has. These high class German car produced only with Twill-fast or Sonneland-A5. Mercedes SL 190, SL 113, SL 107 and SL 129 have been all done with Sonnenland-Classic. Still exactly this fabric is used for the tops of these cars, if you by today directly such a original-top from the dealers.
Conclusion: If you want to be shure to spend your money for a top with good fabric, by a top produced with Sonnenland-Classic or stay-fast.
If you want to take a risk, buy a cheaper top made of "mohair". Maybe (???) you can have luck and the top is not bad. But you take a risk.
The second important thing with tops is the fitting/shape. If the shape / cut is bad, the fitting / look on the car will be bad. In the international soft-top business american and english producers don't have the best quality moral. Sometimes you have luck and sometimes you buy low quality.
Why do I know all this ? I am a professional soft-top dealer in Germany since 1996.
If you go to a trimmer, he shall know, from which good producer he shall buy the top. If he is mounting also, he has to guarante the quality/fiting/shape/look.
In USA and UK the wish of the buyer for top quality is lower than in Germany. Therefore you can sell low quality in USA and UK , but not in Germany. If we would mount a top with few wrinkles on a Porsche 993, most of the customers would "slaughter" us with a lawer.
To mount such a top by yourself is possible. But the iron frames of the E-type Serie I often need work before mounting the new top. The ledges are thin and often not in a correct "shape". You try to mount the top and the result is bad. Not because of the bad fitting soft-top, but because of a bad fitting "car". Maybe you can find a mounting plan in the internet. I am selling a mounting plan with pictures on a CD for the E-type series III together with the top and mounting glue.
A perfect fitting top for a E-type series I can fit and look perfect.
- A perfect fitting top for the Series III will get some typical wrinkles on each side between the back window and the doorgrip after some weeks, beause of a construction mistake of these tops. The "hooktape" is not strong enough, to keep the fabric down between the first and the second tenax knob. If there would be another tenax, the border of the fabric would no be able to move 1 - 2 cm upwards.
- Same problem above both side windows. EVERY normal top has a steel cable inside a fabric-tunel. The cable keeps the fabric down nearby the upper glas border. The e-type top does not have this cable. The "hook-tape" is not strong enough.
Regards Wolfgang Gatza

#6 Re: new hood

Posted: Sat Nov 09, 2019 4:03 pm
by max-it-out
Thanks for that very comprehensive reply Woolfi .Looks like I may have to find a good trimmer and have the hood custom made and fitted to achieve a top class result.Also use the Sonnenland Classic material.
I generally prefer classic cars to show some signs of age - like the lines on the face of an old friend.Those 100 point restoration jobs don`t really impress me - they just look like replicas .In the case of the hood, however , I don`t think there`s any other option than a completely new one....unless I just fit a hard top :mrgreen:

#7 Re: new hood

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 4:40 pm
by Gfhug
Woolfi wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 4:52 pm

The tops for the e-type MUST (!!!) be produced with Sonneland-Classic or 'stay-fast'.

Regards Wolfgang Gatza
Wolfgang, how would someone restoring their E Type in Britain go about getting a hood with your material?
The hood can be one of the last items worked on, but most would need it fitted before the car can be driven, and fitted in Britain not in Germany.
Do you work with any particular dealers in the UK? Can the hood be attached to the frame by the average re-builder or only by a specialist?

I'm several years from needing this work done, but it is always useful to plan ahead.



#8 Re: new hood

Posted: Mon Nov 25, 2019 9:39 pm
by tonyabacus

There are a number of hood manufacturers in the UK and if you are interested in fitting one yourself then can I suggest you have a chat with Jack at BAS International. Don't be put off by their name, they have been producing hoods and trim for Jaguars for over 30 years and are very down to earth.

Jack has spent quite some time talking with me about doing the job and has passed on many, many tips and hints about how to do the job and used non technical language, making it easy to understand where extra care may need to be taken.

I have no connection with them other than buying parts and asking for advice. They are used by one of the leading E Type restorers, who's work has been mentioned on the forum in the past despite the fact he keeps a very low profile, which also speaks for itself. They also produce a nice catalogue.

Jack - Phone: 01633 873664

Hope that is of interest.

#9 Re: new hood

Posted: Tue Nov 26, 2019 8:50 am
by Gfhug
Tony, thanks I've heard very good reports about Jack and he's helped me with other items for my car.
My question was to Woolfi to see if there are any companies in Britain who use his material.



#10 Re: new hood

Posted: Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:51 pm
by tonyabacus
I am sure that if you talk with Jack, he may either have to stuff himself or be prepared to order it and then fit to your car