The 'E' Type Forum

There is currently no VED to pay on pre 1973 cars. Originally the Conservative Government agreed to allow a rolling exemption for cars over 30 years of age to be VED exempt, but Labour stopped it. There is now a petition to re-introduce it here :- http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/183

Sign Up. :thumbsupsmile:

Not a good idea IMHO. Once the number of exempt vehicles climbs - as it would (eventually hugely, since later cars were better rust-proofed) - classic cars cease to become special. At that point we become fair game for all kinds of nasty requirements if we're not careful. It is sometimes useful to be part of a small minority who don't represent much of a tax-raising opportunity.

If you want to alter the VED system then campaign to abolish it altogether and tax on usage, such as by adding money to fuel. That way, all the overseas visitors help pay for our roads and we can have a dozen cars and only pay for the miles we do in any of them. None of this taxing four cars when you hardly drive, say, two of them.

Of course, I can never imagine a zero-fee system becoming universal, so we would probably still need to pay a fiver per car per year. or whatever. Then a fiver per year would become a tenner per year etc. etc.

Have to agree with Pete - once the 'classic' car population grows it will become a target for either some other form of taxation or the green movement. They will claim millions of tons of CO2 plus other pollutants from non-catalytic vehicles are responsible for the poor health or death of our children. They will want to see curbs on use, banning of such vehicles from towns and, ultimately, be used for display only. At the moment the 'pre 73' ownership is so small it is not worth taking on although the EU seems determined to do something about 'old timers'. Best not to stick our heads up over the dashboard methinks! Besides, I can't really see any cars built after 1973 worth saving or according any special treatment.

Heuer wrote: Besides, I can't really see any cars built after 1973 worth saving or according any special treatment.

With (ahem!) the notable exception of Series 3 E-types of course David...

However, owners of same will regard the unwelcome imposition of vehicle excise duty as a mere bagatelle - costing, as it does, merely the price of two tanks of fuel, or 180 miles of spirited motoring, whichever comes first :-)

As I have a worthless, not worth saving Series 3 1973 OTS I wouldn't mind if the VED exemption was increased by only one year.
For those with pre 73 cars I suppose they don't want to raise their heads above the dashboard for fear of getting it shot off!! But I suppose I am being selfish.

I totally agree with Peter and David, and it has nothing to do with the fact that my S3 manufacture date was 21st December 1972 !!

I spent 3 years, a few years ago, designing the business and systems for pay-as-you-go tax collection for car taxation, collecting information from an on-board unit in each vehicle. The costing on this made it prohibitive for a labour government due to all the exceptions involved, and I doubt whether Mr Cameron will see things much differently, even when he starts to spend money?if he gets that far!

Some would argue that this is done already as the more of a gas guzzler your car is, the more petrol you buy and the more you pay. But it's a blunt instrument, not allowing for time, place, type of road and environmental efficiency, and the last point is still sharply in focus with many folks, even though we don't hear much about it due to economics being of more interest.

Talking with government folks at the time, the 'free tax' on pre '73 cars was seen very much as an anomaly by HMRC, which they would like to rationalise....i.e., get rid of. So if the greens don't like it and the tax lot don't like it.....it really is best to keep quiet!

As for 180 miles on a tank of petrol when pushing on Peter, if the Strombergs are tuned that lean you?d have a very hot engine or a holed piston pretty quickly!

MarkE wrote: As for 180 miles on a tank of petrol when pushing on Peter, if the Strombergs are tuned that lean you?d have a very hot engine or a holed piston pretty quickly!

Indeedy doody Mark - which is why I allotted you *two* tankfuls if you re-read my post. Generous I know, but that's me - all heart :-)

SESH wrote:As I have a worthless, not worth saving Series 3 1973 OTS I wouldn't mind if the VED exemption was increased by only one year.
For those with pre 73 cars I suppose they don't want to raise their heads above the dashboard for fear of getting it shot off!! But I suppose I am being selfish.

Sorry I should have said designed after 1973. The Porsche 911 Carrera RS falls into the same category as the S3, an undoubted classic but paying the VED is small beer for what you get. I am sure I read somewhere that certain cities in Europe are banning all cars without catalytic converters and insist the old timers (to use that lovely Germanic expression) will not be exempt. A quick Google search confirms

http://tinyurl.com/4yf2mzf and http://tinyurl.com/3wzvx5k and http://tinyurl.com/3tcemja

So Amsterdam, Stuttgart, Paris, Lyon, Bordeaux, Nice, Grenoble, Clermont-Ferrand, Aix-en-Provence and Saint-Denis are already there!

Clermont Ferrand ??? I didn't think anyone had actually been there since the days of the Vichy Government!

SESH wrote:There is currently no VED to pay on pre 1973 cars. Originally the Conservative Government agreed to allow a rolling exemption for cars over 30 years of age to be VED exempt, :

I think it was 25 years, not 30, so the statement in the petition which announces they want to 'reintroduce' the 30 year rolling system is wrong. I think factual accuracy is a fundamental requirement for any petition, otherwise it is unlikely to be taken seriously.

On the other hand, make it 23 years and I'll get the XJ-SC under the wire.

No matter, I would prefer a system whereby we were taxed on the mileage driven (or fuel consumed), as Peter has suggested.

I thought we already were? I spent ?1200 on fuel through France and ?650 of that went on tax and VAT.

The 40 year rolling exemption is confirmed. This time next year all E-types will have finally paid their dues...

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... icles_.pdf

Simon P wrote:The 40 year rolling exemption is confirmed. This time next year all E-types will have finally paid their dues...

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... icles_.pdf

Don't rock the boat I heard you say! Don't sign the petition in case someone suddenly decides that it's not a good idea to give Historic cars exemption! And all those doubters should hold their heads in shame. We have now got a fair system that allows all cars over 40 years of age to be tax exempt! :D

also worthy of note is....

It was also announced that from 1 April it will be possible to pay for VED monthly, rather than in blocks of 6 or 12 months. In addition, paper tax discs are to be scrapped and any existing tax must be removed from a vehicle prior to its sale.

"any existing tax must be removed from a vehicle prior to its sale"

Sounds unnecessarily bureaucratic. Wonder where the sense is in that?

SESH wrote:

Simon P wrote:
Don't rock the boat I heard you say! Don't sign the petition in case someone suddenly decides that it's not a good idea to give Historic cars exemption! And all those doubters should hold their heads in shame.

Not being thrilled by any tax bill, I'm happy to see I'd avoid paying VED on any 40+ UK classic if I still lived there. I just hope that being exempt from paying VED doesn't eventually put you in a quaint special class of hobby road user that can also be made exempt from full and free use of the roads like those who do pay.

I live in one of many US states where registering your car as an historic brings restrictions on use. Even if they tend to be honored more in the breach than the observance, the principle of 'second class access' has been well and truly established all over the USA, as it has in some countries much closer to the UK. All I was saying, which has not yet been disproven, is that being classified separately from mainstream car use *may* end up having unintended consequences in the long run (including the potential loss of long runs).

But yes, enjoy the upside and fill your boots while you can.

Pete

"any existing tax must be removed from a vehicle prior to its sale"

Sounds unnecessarily bureaucratic. Wonder where the sense is in that?

Probably the case that you will only get a refund on any complete unused months on your tax disc when you sell a car, while the purchaser will have to start their tax disc from the start of the month when they buy it. That way the government gains a month's VED on any vehicle that changes hands.

Spot on! They never miss a trick.

"I live in one of many US states where registering your car as an historic brings restrictions on use. Even if they tend to be honored more in the breach than the observance, the principle of 'second class access' has been well and truly established all over the USA, as it has in some countries much closer to the UK. All I was saying, which has not yet been disproven, is that being classified separately from mainstream car use *may* end up having unintended consequences in the long run (including the potential loss of long runs). "

Pete, you're right about second class status for historic vehicles. Road maintenance is generally funded through gasoline taxes which should give an E Type (particularly a Series 3) privileged status on the roads compared to today's hybrids. I think that the government's general idea is that, "if we're going to give you a break on what you have to pay to drive your car, even though you don't use it as your regular daily driver, you shouldn't be able to use it as much as you please." Uncle Sam will get his pound of flesh.

What are these restrictions of which you speak?