Jaguar metallics

[PeterCrespin]

Today we assume metallic finishes are made up of a base coat and separate lacquer, but was this true in the E-type's day?

You can still get single-coat gloss metallics today and in fact I am having the Series 1.5 2+2 resprayed this week in a single-coat paint. It's a Jaguar colour that judging by the swatches laid against the original under-bonnet paint is a fair approximation to Opalescent Silver Grey.

The only metallic car we ever had when I was a kid was a 68 Ford MkIV Zodiac/Executive, in Silver Fox. I was about 15-16 by the time we got that and I seem to recall it was a single-coat paint rather than base coat plus lacquer. Could be wrong. I'm certain at least that you could buy Silver Fox in a rattle can from Halfords with no separate top coat, because I used it for lots of silver bits on my bikes.

Do we have anyone who was painting car finishes back in the day and who knows for sure?

Pete

[Heuer]

Jaguar used nitro-cellulose until 1960 when they switched to synthetic enamel. From 1979 they used thermoplastic acrylic enamel. The synthetic enamel is a single stage paint (main colour and reducer) so all you do is mix it and apply, hence the availability of rattle cans in the day. The thermoplastic acrylic enamels are made of three parts (main colour, reducer and hardener) and will be much more durable because of the hardener added to the mix. These paints contain isocyanates so are highly toxic. Modern paints are 'base clear' which means the colour coat is put on first followed by a clear coat for shine and protection. They are usually heat hardened.

Lots of people maintain the older paints were more durable although they did suffer from fading and oxidisation. Not sure there is any real benefit in going back to the older formulations other than nostalgia!

[MarkE]

The old Silver Fox, Blue Mink and Saluki Bronze Ford colours were a one stage paint...no clear coat. And for some reason these three colours used to last for weeks before they peeled off!

We are now discovering a lot of Mk 2 Lotus Cortinas that were painted one of these colours, but repainted white with a green stripe as soon as the metalic paint started to go, and genuinely, it was usually within 3 years.

Not as bad as the Jaguar sytem used in the mid 70s though. They used to warn against using a power washer as it would strip the paint...driving through heavy rain could do the same.

I understand that using a clearcoat is a way of evening out the colour layer, yet another technique for making poor workmanship look half reasonable.

Bring back cellulose!

[christopher storey]

I had a very interesting discussion at Oulton Park on Sunday on this very subject . My recently rebuilt FHC has been done in 2 pack, and very shiny it looks. However , I am having terrible troubles with stone chipping around the mouth of the bonnet. ( When I say terrible I mean I have collected half a dozen in 5,000 miles ) .I saw a car on Sunday, also in OSB, which had not a single chip. When I asked the chap if it was a brand new paint job, he said no, it was done 13 years ago!! The difference was it was cellulose, and while it wasn't (quite) as shiny , it is clear that it is much less brittle than modern 2 pack

In addition, getting old colours in modern paints is very expensive - the paint materials alone on my FHC were ?1500 , and when I queried it I was shown the supplier's invoice . Thus the moral seems to be , use cellulose, or use a modern shade which is as near to the old one as one can get

[Nick]

I daresay 13 years ago you could have used cellulose paint without todays 'elf and safety legislation. I think it would be difficult to get a commercial paintshop to do it for you now.

Nick

[ChrisC]

Its mostly water based now, there was a european legislation that decreed solvent based paints were to be outlawed.

You can still buy cellulose for the domestic market but most sprayers appear to use a colour base over sprayed with a two part lacquer. The paint suppliers went nuts because it meant they had to remix every single one of their colours...

Mercedes brought out a scratch resistant lacquer that I opted for when I had the car sprayed and we will see that lasts but allegedly it is supposed to resist 400 grade sandpaper but I dont think i will be trying it to find out...

[PeterCrespin]

Mercedes brought out a scratch resistant lacquer that I opted for when I had the car sprayed and we will see that lasts but allegedly it is supposed to resist 400 grade sandpaper but I dont think i will be trying it to find out...

Be interesting to see what happens. Scratch resistance requires hardness, chip resistance requires plasticity. On the face of it (sorry!) the two are at opposite ends of the deformability spectrum. You can't scratch glass easily but it does chip. You can scratch Perspex easily but it doesn't chip.... Doubtless BASF or whoever they contract to will have come up with some miracle coating.

[skiday]

I don't know much about paint, but my bulkhead is being painted right now, and my sprayer showed me 2-pack paint that had gone off in a tub and he was showing me how flexible it is when cured. Strange then, it seems, that if it is flexible, that it attracts stone-chips.

I painted the area first with ?POR15? to ensure it will never rust again in my lifetime, then painted it with ?POR15 Tie-Coat Primer? which should allow any paint to be applied on top apart from cellulose (according to the tech sheet), but it still reacted in places (mostly around the edges) Very annoying. We're working on a solution.

Is it true that any primer must ALWAYS be rubbed down before applying the colour base coat? I thought the purpose of primer was to be slightly rough when dry and therefore a perfect surface for further coats. Certainly the Tie-Coat Primer was smoother to the touch after flatting with 600 than raw.