Windscreen wipers!

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:26 pm

Hi - I'm looking a number of E types to buy, either a coupe or a 2+2. One I have seen (in an advert) appears to be ideal, is a 2+2, restored and retrimmed, at an (almost) reasonable price! The vendor has given me the chassis number which seems to check out as being a UK car, but from the photos, I see that the wipers park on the passenger side rather than the driver's. I always thought that the wipers on RHD cars parked on the right (driver's side) and on LHD, parked on the left. Can anyone advise me further on this as the car is a couple of hundred miles from where I live and I don't want a wasted journey! Thanks, Malc

Post by **1954Etype** » Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:43 pm

Apologies if this seems rude as it isn't meant to be :D You are looking to spend a lot of money on a car that you appear to have little knowledge about. (not sure what can go wrong!). FWIW though, the wipers could be fitted the wrong way and there are numerous clues that can tell you if the car isn't what it seems to be. I recommend Pete Crespins' buyers guide as a good starting point.

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:26 pm

Hi - thanks for your comments - fair enough although I already have Pete Crespin's guide (and a few others as well!) and where it is mentioned, it says that the wipers on RHD cars all park on the right and the one I was thinking of looking at (not buying yet!) has the wipers on the left despite it apparently being UK supplied (with chassis no to match). What I cannot find from my books and magazines is if any RHD cars ever had wipers that parked on the left - if they did not, then there is something amiss with the car in the advert, and therefore not worth my travelling 200 miles to view.

Post by **1954Etype** » Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:31 pm

Malc, it might be worth viewing. Like I said it is possible to fit the wipers wrong as it is the same rack (IIRC). I've seen too many people ripped off buying rubbish cars that I always urge prudence. Have you got any detailed photos - you can normally tell a lot from them.

abowie · Post by **abowie** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 12:20 am

Hi and welcome to the forum!

I agree that this sets alarm bells ringing with me too.

To me, if the car has the wipers pointing the wrong way, the most likely reason is because the car has been converted from LHD at some stage.
There are far more knowledgeable forum members than me here, but I doubt that a RHD car would have come out of the factory with LHD wipers, which requires different arms to function. I suppose the resrorer could have acquired a set of LH arms and installed them in restoration, but depending on the wiper motor that's not always easy to do.

If you have the chassis number have a look at http://www.xkdata.com/ and see if anything comes up.

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 10:17 am

Why not post the pictures here and we can give you some more direct advice. The position of the wipers is dictated by the wiper motor which is different for a LHD car. Now at some point someone could have bought and fitted a replacement not knowing this and decided to live with the new park position. It would mean the wiper arms would have to be changed so that is your first clue. Details on how to post photos on the Forum are here: http://etypeuk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1666

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 11:54 am

Hi - thanks for your advice. Probably a bit difficult to put any photos up as the only ones are those from the vendor's ad (on a well known auction site!) so who knows if he reads this forum. I have e-mailed him however to try and get some further info, although the chassis no given doesn't seem to check out on the xkedata website (even though it's within the parameters published for this year/model), although the Jaguar Heritage website is down for maintenance at the moment so I can't do a second check. Funnily enough I've just found another Series 2 2+2 on the web at a dealer, which is apparently an orignial UK car, but also has wipers parked on the left - and there's only two wipers rather than three. I obviously need to do a bit more research!

ChrisC · Post by **ChrisC** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 2:52 pm

To help with you car choice: 8)

All series 1 cars have 3 wipers (and covered headlights)
Most series 1.5 cars have 3 wipers (some early cars have covered headlights but not all)
All Series 2 cars have 2 wipers and uncovered headlights
All series 3 cars have 2 wipers.

The XKEData website is not an official Jaguar site and does not have all the chassis numbers listed as it is up to the cars owner to publish that information there.

Why not post the link to the car here so that we can take a look at it?

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 3:04 pm

This one?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/300798253475?cl ... 0926137185

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 3:09 pm

No, this one!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/251157042692? ... 1423.l2648

Incidentally, this one below is advertised as a S1.5, but looks to me like as S1 (cowled lights, dash, engine). Any views?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1967-JAGUAR-E ... true&rt=nc

Thanks. Malc

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 5:48 pm

Well I've spoken to the owner of the car being sold, and he confirms that he has all the documentation, heritage certificate etc and a bundle of history to prove that it is a UK RHD car and thinks that probably when it was being restored a few year ago, they used a LHD wiper rack because everything else seems RHD, including instruments etc. :) Still not surprising after 50 years that some cars have been changed around a bit - at least they are still on the road! Malc

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:08 pm

The wiper rack is the same for both LHD and RHD, it is the motor that is different. It is relatively easy to reconfigure the motor from LHD to RHD and there are comprehensive instructions in our Knowledge Base. You will need to buy two RHD wiper arms as well. Looks like a nice car although the power steering is not that desirable and does not attract a premium unless you have a specific physical difficulty. There are modifications to make it less sensitive - ask the S3 owners - or de-activate it which would make the car much nicer to drive. I would also get rid of those funky yellow HT leads and fit the standard black leads and cable organiser.

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:13 pm

Thanks David - that's really useful. Malc

christopher storey · Post by **christopher storey** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 6:36 pm

Although it is dangerous to judge from photos, this looks quite a nice car although it is very definitely right at the top end of the price spectrum for an S2 2+2. I would be virtually certain that it is a RHD car and I would not get too wound up about the wiper situation. You should note that the S2 2+2 has a windscreen which goes right forward almost to the bonnet rear edge at its centre and thus has a good deal more curvature on it than the screen on an S1 or 1.5 . The wipers as originally arranged for rhd thus do not wipe much of the extreme rhs of the screen and it may be that a previous owner has deliberately had the mechanism rejigged ( it only takes perhaps an hour if you know what you are doing ) to the lhd pattern

I note that this car has been on e bay 3 times since July, but its failure to sell may be connected with the price

ChrisC · Post by **ChrisC** » Sun Oct 21, 2012 7:41 pm

Personally I am with with Chris - the S2 looks the better car - the panel fit is definitely much better (looking at photos) and it doesn't *feel* like a car that has been tarted up to make money by the seller. It may well make a nice car once the engine bay is sorted out.

The wipers can be sorted its certainly not the priority when looking at Etypes :D

Why not take a look at the car in the flesh and report back?

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 1:06 am

Malc wrote:Well I've spoken to the owner of the car being sold, and he confirms that he has all the documentation, heritage certificate etc and a bundle of history to prove that it is a UK RHD car and thinks that probably when it was being restored a few year ago, they used a LHD wiper rack because everything else seems RHD, including instruments etc. :)

They also fitted a Series 1 cooling system which is odd. There should be no S1 header tank and the radiator inlet should be on the left side and it should have twin fans etc.. I would be sceptical about any number stamped on the picture frame as this must have been changed when using the S1 fan arrangement, unless it has an electric fan fixed to the back of the radiator core. Some questionable items at any rate...

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 9:40 am

Thanks Peter - very kind of you. It strikes me that this is probably a car left alone! If the restoration company fitted an S1 cooling sysyem to an S2 (especially if there is only one fan rather than two with all the potential overheating problems that are well known), and also fitted the wipers the wrong way round, then who knows what else they did wrong. The vendor also told me that the restoration company (in London) have gone out of business in the last year and maybe there was good reason!

To push my luck, Peter, could you let me have your opinion of this one below:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1967-JAGUAR-E ... true&rt=nc

It's advertised as a Series 1.5 whereas it seems to me to be a Series 1. I note (from your book!) that both Series 1 and 1.5s were produced in 1967 in 2+2 form but the 1.5 only from December 1967. It might be more valuable if it is a Series 1 (40% to 35% I note), although, price wise, it is still at the top end.

Thanks, Malc

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Mon Oct 22, 2012 12:52 pm

The other one might be OK provided ALL of the cooling system was S1 but that would involve a new S1 picture frame or at best a welded-on bracket - neither of which I would expect to see on an 32K S2 2+2. But then I've never seen a 32K S2 2+2 so we're in uncharted territiry at that sort of money which is ridiculous IMHO.

The other one looks pure S1 from what I can see. The earliest cars (sometimes called S1.25) were identical to S1 but with open lights and that one has closed lights with the correct S1 diaphragms and buckets. So it's not just a case of a botch to covered S1 bonnet trims. To be sure you need the Car Number and check it against the known S1.25/S1.5 sequences.

Still pretty damn strong at 30K but they aren't Jag specialist. I bet they get no bidders and you can low-ball them a sensible offer.

Malc · Post by **Malc** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:22 am

The chassis number of the 'Series 1.5' above is IE50736, and the vendor tells me the build date was 13th February 1967. This therefore appears to be a Series 1 as the Series 1.5 2+2s weren't made until December 1967 and the chassis numbers started 50975 (thank you Peter). While the price of 30k is still too much, at least a Series 1 is slightly more valuable than a Series 1.5 (25k compared to 23k?). The car looks good and the history seems to stack up - apparently it is on the E-Trype Register. Even with my limited knowledge, there are some shockers out there but it's fun trying to find out all the details and trying to recognise the duff ones! Anyone seen the green E-Type with the brown Porsche seats? Anyway, thanks for all your posts - back to the books and the internet!

Post by **Heuer** » Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:27 am

Malc wrote: - apparently it is on the E-Trype Register.

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