quarter light hinge pillar seal fitting

[JD-JAG66]

I have already had to order a new quarter light hinge pillar seal, since I messed up the first one that I received in trying to get it to fit.
Applied the usual tricks with soap and oil and when that didn't work, I tried to cut down (=messed up ) the seal so it would fit the chrome finisher. No such luck.
So, am I doing something wrong? Is there a special trick for fitting these seals?

[Mich7920]

Hi JD,

You couln't have the good one, it coud be the one for the door and not for the hinge pillar.
Check the other seals, pillar and door, I think you'll see the mistake.

Cheers
Mich

[Series1 Stu]

Hi

For series 1 coupes the parts manual quotes the same part number for both the hinge pillar and the door frame upright (BD17071/2).

Its a long time since I did mine but I remember it being an awfully difficult job and, to add insult to injury, I realised I'd fitted them the wrong way around.

It was a pig of a job but I found the best way was to put one side of the Tee into the slot and used a thin brass bar with the end flattened and rounded off to tease the other leg into the slot. I used a light oil (Hellerine)to help it into place. It took ages. The brass tool was used to reduce the risk of scratching the chrome.

I think my seals came from Hutsons.

Regards

[Mich7920]

You're right Stuart...
Not good for the nerves of JD

[JD-JAG66]

I think I'll have a drink now.
Will have a go at Stuart's method.
Cheers

[Hugo]

Anything involving rubber like this can be a nightmare. The rubber is possibly bigger and harder than the original. I wouodn't be scared of trimming the edges of those flanges down a bit. I did a similar job on an Aston DB6 and it was one of the worst jobs I can remember. I still have nightmares about it!
If this were mine (and one day I will have to do this) I would research different rubbers. C.O.H. Baines are close to me in Tunbridge Wells and they make anything and everything.
I fitted a windscreen to my DB6 many years ago - got the rubber from astons, and it was horrible! Like plastic, not rubber. Anyway, as I was inserting the filler strip I felt the tool slip. Puzzled, I took a closer look and found that the rubber had cut right through on the edge of the glass at that point. So I threw the (expensive!) rubber away, went to Baines, got a proper rubber seal and fitted it no problem.
I had a new windscreen fitted to one of my coaches, together with a new rubber. Normally I fit the screens myself, but I know what these rubbers are like so I got someone in to do the job. it took two men a whole morning just to fit the rubber! And the rest of the day to fit the glass - they had to pull it in with ratchet straps around the front of the screen and in through the side window then out through the door. They put so much tension on the straps that they bent the aluminium side window channel. How they didn't break the glass I'll never know. I'd love to know how they fit them at the factory when they built the vehicles though.

[Series1 Stu]

Anything involving rubber like this can be a nightmare. The rubber is possibly bigger and harder than the original. I wouodn't be scared of trimming the edges of those flanges down a bit.

You worry me, Hugo.

I wouldn't recommend it. You really don't want it to leak after all the hard work. It just needs patience.

Is the same seal used on the OTS?

It can be done!

Regards

[Hugo]

Why should it leak if you trim it to fit?
All I am saying is there is a vast variation in consistency and in size of replacement 'rubbers', depending where made and how long they've been on the shelf. If you buy a big-end shell or a piston you can be confident it will fit and will do the job. If you buy anything made of 'rubber', these rules don't apply and anything goes. Aftermarket stuff is a gamble, and NOS is probably worse, as the rubber will have gone hard over the years it's been sitting on somebody's shelf, possibly exposed to daylight.
I do quite a bit of of this sort of stuff, and my policy is rather than struggle with some after-market cr@p that bears only a passing resemblance to the original both in texture and size, I just pop down to Baines and get something that will actually do the job and will go into the gap it's supposed to go into. This is something I have learned from bitter experience!
The one in the pic just needs it 'wings' clipping a bit by the look of things. They don't stop it leaking - they just stop it falling out - or in this case going in.

[Series1 Stu]

The point is that the seals do fit. It's just a struggle.

Regards

[Hugo]

That statement may or may not be true. I don't know, as I haven't tried. But what I DO know is that what we call rubber comes in different consistencies, and it changes with age.
The truth of your statement, I would suggest, depends on who has supplied the seal in question, what it is made of, and how old it is. Ok, the last two don't govern the fit, but they will make a difference to how hard the job is. Time and again I've seen seals for various vehicles that simply do not fit, or more accurately that are a different size from the original. Almost anything can be made to fit if you're determined enough, but bear in mind that you cannot compress rubber.
Personally I wouldn't waste my time with old or hard rubber, but then I'm not a masochist

[Series1 Stu]

Ok Hugo.

If you read my post you will see that I have done it and therefore I do know but I don't expect that that would make any difference to your entrenched opinion.

Nowhere did I say that my rubbers were old or hard, that was brought to the thread by you, I believe.

Finally, you most certainly can compress rubber. Why else do you think it's used to make seals? It compresses under relatively light loads to take up a given shape and it is this gap filling ability that forms the seal. Most materials are compressible, including steel, given the right amount of force. What I think you meant to say was that you can't change the volume of the rubber, unlike an open cell foam material.

Regards

[Hugo]

I am not disputing that you have done it, or indeed that it can be done. I am not actually disagreeing with you - I am saying something different, and I would be surprised if you would disagree with me either.
What I am saying is that what we call 'rubber' comes in many forms, from many different suppliers, and may consist of many different materials with different characteristics. I have had 'rubber' seals that feel more like plastic - none more so than the 'correct' OEM windscreen rubber I bought from Astons many years ago, and which I had to throw in the bin because it was completely unsuitable. It was more plastic than rubber - you could pull one of the lips out & it would stay bent - it would go back eventually instead of springing back as you would expect. I have come across stuff like this a few times over the years. I have no idea what this stuff is, and I don't care. All I know is I don't like it.
One thing I would disagree with, however, is when you say that you can compress rubber. I believe I am correct in saying that you can deform rubber, but not compress it. It is, in effect, a liquid. I remember from my schoolboy physics that whereas gases and liquids are both fluids, the difference between a liquid and a gas is that a gas can be compressed whereas a liquid cannot. You push rubber in in one place, it just pops out in another. Rather like my waistline.

[Series1 Stu]

Like I said. It will deform, not change volume.

[Hugo]

You said "compress". That implies a change in volume, does it not? I'm the one who said "deform". You're worse than my wife

[Series1 Stu]

If I was your wife, I'd be a divorcee!

[Hugo]

Yeah - it would never work