Garage lifts, 2 or 4 post?

[thegfb]

I am about to build a 7 x 6m double garage and I would like to install a car lift in it. I need to decide which type of lift to go for and wonder what the views of others might be as to the optimum choice for use with my S1 FHC and possibly other cars too.

A 2 post lift appears to offer maximum unobstructed access to the underside of the car though this would perhaps place a load on the rear axle mounts as I guess this assembly would 'hang' whilst on the raised 2 post lift. Another possible issue for me might be that I need to build the garage within the 'permitted development' regulations which dictate max 2.5m at the eaves and max 4m at the ridge. A 'gambrel' style roof is I believe permitted and offers slightly more internal space to accomodate a lift. The height of the posts of a 2 post seem to be around 2.8m tall and the width of the assembly on the floor 3.4m or so which may make it difficult to accomodate in a position that still allows 2 cars to park unless the roof can be offset in some waty whilst still meeting PD regs.

A 4 post lift appears to offer a lower overall post height and the Strongman enthusiast range narrower width. However under car access seems to be relatively restricted compared to a 2 post lift. Does a 'jacking plate' improve things in this regard? Would this enable work on the unloaded suspension with the wheels off the ramps?

A scissor type lift seems to combine the potential restrictions to under car access of both 2 post and 4 post lifts though the type that is flush in the garge floor when lowered certainly offers more free garage space when the lift is not in use.

Is a 1.8m lift capability high enough? On it's wheels on a 4 post the chassis is going to be a further .5 of a metre up I assume, which I would think means adequate working head height.

Your thoughts gratefully received.

GF

[christopher storey]

The problem with a two post lifts are several

1. Getting the arms to appropriate support points can be difficult

2. You cannot have a moveable 2 post lift, whereas 4 posters can be equipped with castors

3.For E types, achieving proper point of balance can be difficult

4. You still have to grovel under the car to setup the lift before lifting

On the other hand, with a 4 poster

1. You can just drive the car on

2.It is inherently stable, so no worries if e.g you want to remove the rear suspension

3.It is an advantage to be able to have the wheels either freely rotating or locked by weight

4.However, with the jacking platform,which is an essential accessory , a 4 poster is likely to be more expensive

5. Some of the 4 posters can be arranged to accommodate a further car underneath for storage

No doubt other contributors can add to the list of merits of both types, but personally I would go for a 4 post lift with castors so that for really filthy jobs like eg pressure washing mud off the underside, you can go outside and still use the lift

[kingzetts]

Here's my two-pence worth.

My workshop/garage has gravel outside so I can't make use of a lift on castors to go outside so not relevant for me.

I have up-and-over garage doors which protrude a long way into the garage when open and would foul the posts of a 4-post lift, so I would need new garage doors if I fitted a 4-post.

My workshop has a 9' ceiling which is too low for most 2-post lifts. Although the roof is pitched and a lot taller than 9' across most of the length of the garage, the roof is of pre-stressed trusses which can't readily be modified to increase ceiling height.

For me therefore the only currently affordable option (not being made of money and not wanting to effectively re-roof the garage) I recently purchased a 2 post lift from CJ Autos in Heywood which is of a low post design and will fit under my restricted ceiling height. It is "moveable" in that you can unbolt the columns and wheel them around on castors but it can only be used where you have fitted the required ground anchors into suitably-thick concrete. I've provided two bolt-down stations at different widths apart so I can use it with both narrow vehicles with lifting points towards their centrelines (e-type and 924) and wider ones with perimeter lifting points (XKR, Boxster and X5).

I know it will frustrate me to some extent as I won't get the cars as high as I'd like, but its a hell of a lot better than trolley jacks and axle stands. As for the point about e-type rear suspension cages falling off if the metalastic mounts fail, I plan to use a transmission jack under the cage when the E is up on the lift.

That said if I was building a new garage I'd probably do what my mate has done and put in a 4-poster in one bay and a 2-poster in the other!

[Tony]

Hello kingzetts,

I have recently built a 2 car garage within the permitted development rules as you have stated. I have recently installed a four post hydraulic lift and I am In the middle of installing it. Being hydraulic the ram goes up above the legs so I have installed a false chimney to acommodate it. It goes above the roof about 500mm so does not give a problem. You can buy chain lifts which do not have a ram so these are less of a problem.
As Christopher stated the four post lift has lots of advantage over the two post lift and with a beam jack are ideal.
Not sure if you are buying new or second hand lift. If new you can buy a 4 post lift for about ?1,800 including a beam jack. If second hand the main issues is getting a single phase motor version as they are quite saught after.
I paid ?420 for a second hand 4 post lift with jacking beam. With a little bit of paint it should be fine for domestic use.

[PeterCrespin]

....the roof is of pre-stressed trusses which can't readily be modified to increase ceiling height.

On the contrary, a disposable five-quid ripsaw from ScrewFix will very readily make mincemeat of any inconvenient trusses.

Safely modified - ay, there's the rub.... :-(

[Tony]

Kingzetts,

You should not have to alter the trusses if you have high tie trusses made for the area above where the lift is going. It will not cost you much more than a normal truss. If you look under My dream garage section you will see pictures of my garage showing the roof above the ramp area.
Of if you get really stuck I can post my drawings of the roof trusses.

Tony

[kingzetts]

Tony,
Good points but it is the OP (GF) who is building his garage - I was simply reporting what I had done which suits my circumstances and which I could do without embarking on building works.

GF,
If you have the option, arrange the roof so the ridge line runs across the width of the parking area. That would mean you would have full ridge height over the centre line and could locate the lift at one side leaving the other side free for parking.

Pete,
Indeed - safely. I'd prefer not to wake up one morning and find my e-type had a novel form of hardtop fitted!

[Tony]

Kingzetts

Sorry about that, I picked up the wrong name. GF this was for you so the same applies.

[thegfb]

Thanks for all the info and suggestions. I am in the fortunate position of starting from scratch so can configure the garage as I like, so long as it's within PD regs.
A 4 post lift with jacking beam increasingly seems the way to go for me so long as I can arrange the internal roof structure height to accomodate a lifted car in one of the 2 bays. High tie trusses will help in this regard and optimising the shape of the roof by offsetting the ridge if permissible within PD and building regs.
With regard to Kingzetts suggestion "arrange the roof so the ridge line runs across the width of the parking area" - do you mean that if facing the door/s of the double garage the ridge is at 90 degrees to where the lift might be sited in one of the bays i.e running left to right rather than fore and aft?
Thanks again everyone.
GF

[kingzetts]

Yes, that's what I mean. Put it another way - if the gable walls are to the left and right of the garage door, with the gutters running along the wall above the door and along the back wall, then the nose and tail of the cars will be under the lowest point of the roof and the headroom available for a lift will be optimised and the same across the full width of the parking area. So you have the lift on one side, and a full clear parking bay on the other, and a third car can be parked under the raised lift.

[Tony]

I finished installing my lift today and can get my S type up high enough to
stand under the car without bending, so the e type will be no problem. The ridge hight of my garage is 4m, the eaves is 2.5 metres. The width of the garage is 7m and the length is 9m. To create more height in the garage I have kept the floor 50mm above ground level with the damp course stepped. The garage doors open outwards to avoid problems with up and over doors protruding into the garage. My roof trusses for the garage were about ?1,300. Will post pictures with the E type on the ramp.

[thegfb]

Tony

Thanks for the info - any pictures available yet?

GF

[Tony]

Yes the pictures are posted in the "your Dream Garage " section under "Car Lift Installed at last" and in the same section under " My Dream Garage " showing the construction phases. Some of the pictures are up side down for some unknown reason.
If you have difficulty search under my name "Tony" as author

[Tony]

GF,

Did you manage to find the pictures?

[thegfb]

Found the pictures and am mightily impressed!

Also found the build pics too - fabulous job! Was it all your own work?

What size is your garage? I think you said it's 4m at the roof ridge and 2.5m at the eaves (as PD requirements) but what is the length and width?

I see you used raised tie trusses in the part of the roof where the lift is - what is the height of the ramps when the lift raised as high as it will go with the car on it?

Your lift looks great - bit of paint makes all the difference and what a result finding it for such a great price and with a jacking beam included.

What were your reasons for going for a 4 post lift. I'm inclined to do the same so long as I can have a jacking beam. I note that the pros that I've previously taken my 'E' to for work all seem to have 2 post lifts in the main - apart from those that do MOTs as well who have the 4 post/jacking beam combo for the testing.

I'm still agonising over which one to go for - not sure I can justify going for both as per one of the guys whp've postedo n the subject!

GF

[ALAN COCHRANE]

GF

I have recently installed a 4-post lift in my main garage. I can't recommend it highly enough and fully agree with the other comments made about it's advantages over a two post lift. Just check out Youtube for two post lift accidents and you'd never want to go near one far less under it.
I bought mine off Ebay for ?1800 plus an installation charge. It's specially made for narrow track(vintage) cars which makes it physically smaller than a standard lift.
The only problem I had was the electrical supply to the single phase hydraulic pump motor. They tend to have high starting currents of approximately 50A. This meant I had to change my "B" class 16A circuit breaker for a "C" class 32A cb in the garage consumer unit. The "C" rating is specifically made for motor loads and will allow twice their rating to flow for the few milliseconds required. You will probably also have to uprate the source cb in your main consumer unit.
My garage has a pitched roof with internal triangular trusses and I would suggest that the roof apex should run from front to back not side to side. This gives you the added advantage of being able to lift a convertible up to the underside of the trusses with the windscreen frame up in between them. This would give you added ground clearance and increase the chance of "stacking" two cars. It allows me to store three cars in a two car garage.
Let us know how you get on.

Cheers

Alan

[Tony]

GF,

Please find photos of the basic dimensions of my garage as requested.

I did all the drawing, woodwork, doors, windows and the roofing on the garage including the electrics etc.

As I only have experience of a 4 post lift then I would recommend one and as other have stated seems to have more benefits than a two post lift. You certainly will not need a two post and and four post as a four post does every a two post can do.

If you need more info on the build let me know

Note. The dimensions you cannot see at the side of the elevation are 4m to the ridge and 2.4m to the gutter line. The eaves is lower than .,5m as I wanted to keep a decent pitch on the roof. The definition of the eaves is normally where the underside of the roof meets the outside of the brickwork.

[kingzetts]

Just to reignite debate, I had occasion to remove the IRS this weekend (failed handbrake pad and excess endfloat in a diff output shaft). This was the first major job with my new 2 post lift - what a joy!

I have a stout trolley about 2 foot tall on castors.

Car up on the hoist. Whipped off the rear wheels and rear section of the exhaust, disconnected everything except the rubber mounts, dropped the car down so the IRS sat on the trolley, undid the mounts, lifted the car up leaving the IRS on the trolley - whole job took about 45 minutes.

It got me thinking about how I'd have done the job on a 4-post lift, and I'm not exactly sure. The IRS would be too wide to drop down between the ramps, so not sure you could just do it the same way.

[Heuer]

What a bunch of wimps! This is the way to create the ultimate lift for your E-Type - several height positions, movable and safe:

[Tony]

That's exactly like my lift. I even have a grey jumper, exactly the same.