5 1/2" rims with 185R15 tires?

[ysmalkie]

I am considering mounting the rims I bought the car with on my FHC.

They are 5.5". I am wondering if they are not too wide for standard 185R15 tyres?

Does anyone have such a combination?


Tadek

[Heuer]

The 185 VR 15 tyres are specified for 5", 5.5" and 6" rims. Jaguar offered 5.5" rims for the E-Type in period, albeit they specified "or racing only". The wider rims will marginally firm up the ride and sharpen the handling because the tyre walls are stretched slightly so making them stiffer. If you are spirited driver you will enjoy the combination.

[ysmalkie]

Thanks David,

These are actually Borrani wheels - I am considering restoring them. It's costly, so I need to make sure it will be worth it....

Tadek

[Heuer]

I have Borrani's and boy are they worth it. The weight saving can be immediately felt through the steering wheel and the handling is sublime!

[ysmalkie]

I looked up the prices of new wheels and they are still cheaper than Borrani restoration, however there is the added value in vintage Borranis dated '64... ;-)

Interestingly, they are for Corvette, however I would guess that there was no 5/5" size for an e-type back in the 60ies.

So after 20 minute conversation with Borrani, I decided to send them.

Out of interest, for anyone wondering what's included:
- dismantling
- check for cracks, possible welding of the rim
- polishing of the rim
- chroming of the centre piece
- new spokes
- assembly.

All else is extra, so if your splines are gone, you need new centre piece.

Tadek

[paydase]

Tadek,

If these were for a Corvette, are you sure that the hub/splines are correct for an E-Type?
Same (but less critical as it may be corrected by Borrani when rebuilding the wheel) is the issue of the offset.

Fyi, I bought two years ago a set of "experimental" Borranis for E-Type with 5.5" wide rims:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=17183&hilit=borrani+experimental

I must confess that I have not yet restored the wheels due to the high price quoted by Borrani to do the job.
And quite impossible to find another shop to perform that job at a significantly better price and/or with sufficient quality.
One day I will have to bite the bullet!

Interested however to follow your experience

[ysmalkie]

Interesting! - I missed your story Serge.

Mine seem to have different problems - a number of spokes are broken and the hub splines are not the best.

They also look different, more like the Jaguar competition wheel.


They are dated '64. Back then Borrani only made 5" wheels I believe, so they must have offered these, as a wider option.
The hub is exactly the same as e-type and the offset is 103mm.

As for the price, when I initially enquired, it was 600eur - I should have done it then...
The price now is even higher than you quote, however I am hoping for some discount.

To be honest, I have limited options as these are th only wheels I have - I bought the car with them.
I could buy a new MWS set for about 500eur/piece instead of restoring these. However, the MWS wheels no longer look original, as the rim design has changed so they are not the best option either...

So I need to bite the bullet....

Tadek

[Heuer]

Here are mine - old photo with repro hub cap
These are modern Borrani production from about 2005. They were a demo set and showcased on 9600 HP before I bought them at a very good 'used' price!


Bump stops need to be removed or modified for 5 1/2" or above wheels but you must put bump stops on the shock absorbers to compensate. They are there for a reason.

[ysmalkie]

Well, that 9600HP provenance just adds value! ;-)

Why do the bump stops need to be removed??

Tadek

[paydase]

David, does this (required removal of bump stops) depend on the offset of the wheels.
And in particular, was the offset of the Jaguar 5.5" competion wheels designed as to not require such a removal?

[Heuer]

Yes, it depends on the offset and tyre type. Sometimes the tyre clears the bump stop other times not. It was just a warning to check after fitting and before going on a drive. For example the Dunlop sport has a more bulbous wall than the Michelin XVS. As regards Jaguar advising 5.5" rims for racing, they were expecting the car to be fitted with Dunlop R5 cross-ply tyres which are very skinny indeed so did not cause a problem.

[ysmalkie]

thanks David,

I was actually planning to install Pirellis.

Do you have any indea what offset clears the bump stop?

Tadek

[Heuer]

No idea on Borrani offsets and my Borrani Catalogue does not list them for some reason. They should however be in the range of 28 - 32mm for the E-Type. Backspacing is . For 185 tyres the widths are as follows:

Pirelli Cinturato - 195mm
Dunlop SP Sport - 188mm
Michelin XVS - 186mm
Dunlop R5 - 174mm

Shows how skinny the R5 cross-ply was. The MWS site has the following data:




The back spacing figure is the one you need to check.

[paydase]

David,
I don't know if the MWS wheels as above correspond to the original Jaguar wheels especially wrt the 5.5" wheel. Their triple lacing however seems to correspond.
If so, it would mean that there is no need to remove the bump stops as the backspace of the 5.5" is only 89 mm whereas the one of the 5" is 97 mm. That means that the 5.5" wheel is about 8 mm further out of the wheel arch, with a rear track substantially increased because also of the added width of a 185 tyre on a wider rim.
If there is any issue due to the use of the 5.5" wheels, it would actually be rubbing of the tyres on/under the rear fenders (even more so if it would be a 205/70 tyre)...

Tadek, I measured a backspace of 92 mm for my 5.5" Borrani, which is similar to the 89 mm of the 5.5" MWS.



As advised by David, you should check your backspace.
Also, considering the tyres' widths shown by David, putting Dunlop or Michelin may be a safer bet not to rub.

[ysmalkie]

Many thanks Gentlemen,

I measured my wheel:




My back spacing is 97-98mm.
The 5.5" rim is 167mm
When I install it on the hub, I have about 25mm:



So, this means that:
1/2 of Pirelli is 97.5mm
1/2 of 5.5" rim is 83.5mm
I need 14mm space to fit the tire and I have about 25mm.

So, I should have about 11mm distance left and am good with such a back space, am I correct?

The tires flex, but not that much, am I correct?

Tadek

[Heuer]

Yes, you have plenty of room without having to touch the bump stops.

[ysmalkie]

Thanks David! :-)

[ysmalkie]

Before sending the wheels I decided to take one wheel apart. I was hoping to get the spokes as spare.
My spare wheel has one spoke bent, I was hoping I could change it.
Well, I have to say that it's really very difficult to change these spokes, probably imposible without loosening them. They are _very_ rigid! There is no way you could bend them: they are 5mm/4mm thick.

So, I decided to weigh them for reference:
aluminum rim: 4.32 kg
hub - 1.73 kg
spokes & nipples: 1.56 kg

Together 7.6 kg all together.

Tadek

[paydase]

Tadek,
Do you mean that when trying to unbolt the spokes, the threads snap?
Did you soak the spoke end with penetrant fluid beforehand in case the spoke end attachment was rusted inside?

[ysmalkie]

Well Serge, actualy non of them snapped and I did not use any penetrant - the threads were not rusty.