The 'E' Type Forum

hi Guys, I am very close to putting the engine and box back in the 3.8 FHC and wondered whether there are any tips I should be aware of. Such as whether to have the starter on or off, the Dynamo likewise and the front engine brackets on the block? I am lifting the front of the car up and sliding the engine and box in from underneath. Also, are the starter bolts meant to have the nuts and washers to the rear of the car ( I would assume this) or towards the front in case of needing to remove the starter when engine in situ? A

Anyway, any advice to save me agro later much appreciated.

thx Andrew

Andrew,
My advice would be starter on, dynamo and brackets (if you mean the engine mountings) off. If you have the Moss box it should all lift up vertically once in place underneath - a lot more tricky if you have a 5-speed like my T5. Leaving the water pump pulley and crank pulley off may also make life easier as clearance to the picture frame is tight and these are not too tough to fit later. Cover the picture frame and side frame spars with cardboard taped in place to avoid scratching new paint.

On the starter, the bolts are a bugger to get at once the engine is in. What I did (which may not be to everyone's taste) was to make up a captive nut holder for the starter motor retaining bolts - a sort of sickle-shaped plate to which I welded a pair of nuts and then bolted the whole lot to another one of the bellhousing bolts. The welded-on nuts sit in the right place for the starter bolts to come through from the front and engage. This means I don't need access to the nuts at all. Then I used allen-headed bolts and I found this meant I could easily fit and remove the starter bolts using a longish extension bar on a 3/8" ratchet handle. It worked - swapping my original Lucas starter for a gear reduction unit a couple of years later was a doddle.

Good luck.

http://www.projectetype.com/index.php/t ... t5-in.html for a few pics.

Don't forget to put the tailshaft in before you install the engine; you can't get it in afterwards.

You can also fill the box with oil before you install it. Redline MT90 really is the go for genuine Jag boxes.

Starter motor on, I put nuts to the front. Make sure it works properly before you put the engine in and that all wiring is secure because you won't be able to get at it once the engine's in. If you have fitted a hi torque aftermarket unit with inbuilt solenoid consider connecting the solenoid wire to the main power terminal on the starter. This will save you running a wire to either the starter button or the solenoid near the battery.

Dynamo off. Waterpump on, harmonic balancer on. Engine steady bar on; Make sure you have the brackets in the correct orientation.

Clutch slave cylinder AND rigid pipe on, with the little support bracket on. Aligning the pipe and tightening the fitting is quite tricky with the engine in. You can also fit the flexible pipe and tape it to the block.

I leave the engine brackets off but have the engine mounts installed on the frames. This gives you a little extra wiggle room. Once you're close you can put all the bolts in loosely and then tighten it all up solid.

Where you run into trouble is with the very back of the block casting impinging on the reaction tie plate. the trick here is to wobble the engine on the stand to get them through. Some cars seem easier than others.

The engine steady bar is only for minimising engine side to side movement. It won't support the weight of the engine and can't be used to lever the engine into poitioin. Read the manual about the process for adjusting it; it needs to be almost loose or it will cause horrible noises.

Several points about Andrew's suggestions with which in large measure I agree, however : - 1.I have no idea what is being suggested about the reaction plate . It is quite impossible to install the engine and gearbox with the reaction plate in position. 2. I cannot be certain about this, but in the photos , I think that the reason the engine steady was out of vertical is that the bottom mounting is attached in a direction which is wrong by 180 degrees 3. My experience is that, although it is much safer to do the job from the bottom, paradoxically the clearances are much more critical , particularly at the rear of the engine, so it is absolutely vital to have a watcher for these clearances which are as little as 6mm / quarter inch at some points of the operation

abowie wrote: You can also fill the box with oil before you install it. Redline MT90 really is the go for genuine Jag boxes.

But for the Moss gearbox on a 3.8, Red line MTL is what you need.

christopher storey wrote:Several points about Andrew's suggestions with which in large measure I agree, however : -

1.I have no idea what is being suggested about the reaction plate .

engine steady bar is wrong by 180 degrees 3.

The reaction plate ears on the engine frames; my bad for posting when half asleep.

I think it is in the right way around; at least that's the direction it is in the pictures in the parts manual. The scalloped cutout at the back seems to be there to clear the seam at the bottom of the firewall. I took it off in the end.

well, that's an amazing response . Many thanks. I have already filled the gearbox with Red Line and starter rebuilt and tested, but all of the rest of the intel is very much appreciated. I had no idea, its a long time since I stripped it down, how tight the lump is within the picture frames. Annoyingly I have just put on the water pump and top pulley, so on balance I think I will leave those in place, and also had a massive bonfire of all my cardboard yesterday. must plan more!

I would like to know which way that engine steady goes around, now there seems to be some contradiction. I will check my original photos for a clue. Also, I have rebuilt the carbs on the manifolds and am assuming I can refit these in one lump, I removed them like this but it was a struggle getting to some of the lower nuts. Ah well good for the knuckles.

Just waiting for a delivery of a new Propshaft from SNG. I spoke to a few restorers to see where they got there pops balanced and was told they don't bother, by the time they have bought and fitted UJs its cheaper to buy a new prop complete. I just hope its a good part and properly fitted. Am I mad, should I just refit my own non balanced and hope?

Hmmm! Just been and looked at my cars . The S1 4.2 has the bottom fitting of the stabiliser facing forwards i.e. the opposite way to that shown by Andrew Bowie . The S2 faces backwards, same as AB's. Take your pick !

What is interesting, however, is that I think AB's theory that the holes in his bellhousing may be too far backwards looks to be correct

So whilst this is a very poor photo you can just make out the cut out on my car which had never been stripped and messed with. See that the speedo cable sits in the cut out.

andrewh wrote:So whilst this is a very poor photo you can just make out the cut out on my car which had never been stripped and messed with. See that the speedo cable sits in the cut out.

I reckon that your picture shows the straight edge forward and the scalloped edge to the rear. It's hard to tell but I think the speedo cable is being held by that special clip with the 90 degree twist in it. It bolts into a hole at the bottom of the V shaped frame support that is welded to the firewall. Sorry but I can't get the image to show..

http://www.flickr.com/photos/71499700@N08/13020278234

It's the sort of part that is likely to be reinstalled in either direction whenever the engine is removed and replaced. FWIW in the 3.8 parts manual it is show orientated with the straight edge forward and the scallop behind.

If anyone has a copy of the book 'Jaguar e-type ' by Matthew L Stone - on page 57 there is a photo from Jaguar archives of an engine and gearbox on a Jaguar test rig - this clearly shows the lug holes facing backwards.


hope this helps

Barrie

Just fitting the cam covers and I have another question. There are O rings on the rev drive and the inlet side cam plug. Is there another larger O ring on the outside of the inlet cam plug? There is a larger O ring which is in the gasket kit and appears to fit over the inlet plug behind the O ring in the groove. If this is correct it would be visible at the very rear of the cam cover on the inlet side and would be an additional seal on that side? Hope that's clear