Oil Filter - spin off or traditional?

norman jones · Post by **norman jones** » Mon May 06, 2013 5:07 pm

My series 1 4.2 FHC is fitted with the spin off type of oil filter. I have read on other sites and in magazines that whilst these filters fit, they may not have the capacity to circulate and filter the required amount of oil per minute.
My system also appears to have developed a leak around the seal and I am now wondering with an oil change due I may go back to the old paper element.

Any thoughts, and how easy is it to reinstate the old canister assembly?

many thanks

Post by **Heuer** » Mon May 06, 2013 5:52 pm

I have read those comments as well but I am not convinced. Yes the standard filter will allow more oil to circulate but there is no evidence the XK engine needs that extra flow capacity or that the spin off filter does not provide sufficient capacity. I have covered 42,000 miles using a spin off filter and I drive my car very hard without any apparent issues. The Mahle OC323 is specified for XK engines and is what I use. Swapping back to the OE cannister seems pointless and is probably a step backwards!

Dave K · Post by **Dave K** » Mon May 06, 2013 6:09 pm

The XJ series of cars had spin off filters as standard so it appears Jaguar doesn't see a problem.

Dave

kingzetts · Post by **kingzetts** » Mon May 06, 2013 8:43 pm

Like David and David I am unconvinced by doubts over the use of spin-on filters, I would be very surprised if they caused oil starvation in the real world.

However, I did go back to the original filter. This was because my particular spin-on adapter leaked profusely at the large o-ring, which I traced to the maximum "pinch" which the adapter could put on the o-ring being insufficient for a good seal (a design or possibly a manufacturing error with the adapter, not a problem with the concept in theory). The original design can put as much pressure on that o-ring as you care to apply to the clamping bolt down the centre - no leaks. Also I found that the amount of mess was much the same either way - a spin-on full of oil held horizontally can spill a lot of oil - and I've not regretted going back to original. I simply remove the air filter canister (30 second job) to get good access before changing the element.

norman jones · Post by **norman jones** » Mon May 06, 2013 8:59 pm

John

Thanks for your reply, (and all the others) I was beginning to think it was me I dread oil change time - This is exactly the problem I am having, the large seal is leaking and they are not available seperatly.
If you take off the adaptor it is a devil of a job getting it to re-seal - too slack and it leaks, too tight and eventually - it leaks again.

Hence to hell with it and go back to the original. I am assuming it is easy to re-fit an old type paper one?

kingzetts · Post by **kingzetts** » Tue May 07, 2013 10:07 am

The large square-section O-ring between adapter body and engine oil transfer block is the same as the one used to seal the original canister to the oil transfer block and I'm pretty sure they are available separately (Jaguar part 6883).

But if you want to go back to the old type it is easy. Remove the spin-on adapter (usually one two-ended bolt through the middle of it I think which both retains the adapter to the oil transfer block, and onto which the spin-on filter screws), replace the large square-section o-ring, assemble the "old" filter with paper element, attach to block with long central bolt, tighten up.

I'd check carefully that you have all the bits of the old filter assembly - there's a good exploded drawing in the factory parts manual (plate 3 on page 11 for the 3.8) but apart from that its easy.

norman jones · Post by **norman jones** » Tue May 07, 2013 11:22 am

I have just been quoted a jaw dropping ?180 for all the bits required to go back to a paper filter!!!!

It looks like I will take off the spin off and try and re- seal the kit using a new sealing ring as suggested by Kingzetts

kingzetts · Post by **kingzetts** » Tue May 07, 2013 11:45 am

If you ask nicely maybe one of the guys on here who have fitted spin-ons will sell you their old paper element units for beer money :D

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Tue May 07, 2013 12:15 pm

kingzetts wrote:If you ask nicely maybe one of the guys on here who have fitted spin-ons will sell you their old paper element units for beer money :D

Sorry - did someone call? Mine's a Morte Subite or Chimay please.

Having used almost exclusively spin-ons - mostly with the S3 XJ filter block, I've changed the original filter style on my three most recent Es and as stated the mess is about the same. Goodness knows what it will be like when I use the totally upside-down Series 2 XJ spin-off on the D-type. Stick to whatever you've got, with maybe a slight bias to spin-offs due to near impossibility of putting it on and getting oil gushing out from a mis-placed canister o-ring.

Pete

vrracing · Post by **vrracing** » Tue May 07, 2013 2:55 pm

It is common practice on modern cars to seal the oil pan to the block using no gasket, just FIPG. My youngest's car was a 91 Toyota MR2 turbo upgraded to well over 300hp at the wheels and the oil pan was sealed with just Toyota's FIPG. If you use a gasket, it leaks. The MR2 was killed by a red light running Lexus SUV. The boy was sore but ok.

Permatex has a variety of FIPG products with different uses. The Toyota FIPG is available at the dealerships and is specifically designed to seal oiling systems. It is expensive at > $10 US per tube but it works extremely well.

I would remove the adapter and clean the surfaces with acetone or lacquer thinner; making sure no residual oil was seeping. Then I'd lightly coat the o-ring with the FIPG and install. Let it sit for 20 minutes (what Toyota specifies when installing an oil pan) and you should be good to go.

vrracing · Post by **vrracing** » Tue May 07, 2013 2:58 pm

By the way, "lightly coat" is very important. It is common on MR2s for people to go crazy with the FIPG and the beads that squeeze out when too much is used have been known to break off and flow thru the oil into the turbo oiling system. Bad things then happen. So don't be that guy!

Oh, another tip. If the adapter spins on, then just tighten it up like usual. If it is held in place with fasteners, then first install it finger tight, wait ten minutes and then torque to spec. That results in a better seal since you're less likely to squeeze out all of the material while it still flows.

norman jones · Post by **norman jones** » Tue May 07, 2013 5:22 pm

Its certainly looking like a spin off now..

The car has been inactive for over 6 months - it has had body work done and it has been at the workshop over the winter They did the job between other more urgent projects. It suited me as my garage was empty for the winter. However this inactivity has poss caused the oil sealing ring to shrink or dry up? thus causing the leak. It is coming from the sealing ring between the adaptor and the block.

norman jones · Post by **norman jones** » Wed May 08, 2013 3:51 pm

This matter has been discussed here and explains my concerns about the upgrade better than I can.

http://e-typeclub.com/wp/index.php/spin ... e-cassidy/

Post by **Heuer** » Thu May 09, 2013 3:25 pm

As someone pointed out earlier, Jaguar themselves fitted spin off oil filters to the later XK engines so there does not appear to be cause for concern.

Dave K · Post by **Dave K** » Thu May 09, 2013 3:46 pm

David,

I pointed this out, however I have an XJ spin on with the oil cooler ports blanked off and the 1" delivery pipe.
Even if I didn't I still wouldn't be concerned.

Dave

Post by **Heuer** » Mon May 13, 2013 11:58 am

Just changed the oil and spin-off filter in anticipation of our next raid into France. Filter came off easily and there was barely a cup full of oil spilt - would have been less if I had turned the filter upwards as soon as I took it off

Contrast that with standard system and making sure you get all 12 bits back in the correct order and not having to be elbow deep in the oil pan looking for the missing ones

andrewh · Post by **andrewh** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 9:33 am

am just about to fit my original oil filter and was reading this thread. First off, my replacement filter is an element rather than a paper corrugated filter, but not sure what 12 bits David is referring to. I have a couple of large plate washers, rubber washer, plain washer, dished large washer, spring and that's about it. Seems to tally with the parts book. Second question, is that the new SNG supplied filter comes with two O rings to seal the filter cover to the housing. One is quite large square section and the other is much thinner but both fit in the groove in the housing. Which do I use as the large square section may compress into the housing when I tighten the large centre bolt, but don't want to do that until I know which is correct?

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 11:19 am

The element SNGB supply is perfectly OK. You should have a rubber washer on the bolt, which goes into the cannister. Then a spring, plain washer, felt washer, large plate washer and clip. Push the filter into place against the spring pressure and offer up to the housing. Make sure you have the other large washer (was at one time magnetic) pressed onto the main housing. I used the thin rubber washer as the thick one made getting the cannister mounted almost impossible (I assembled mine on the bench).

I strongly suggest you use new small rubber and felt washer's if you want leak free service. Also, when you get around to replacing the filter, don't forget to remove the drain bolt on the housing before loosening the cannister.

More information here: http://etypeuk.com/forum/viewtopic.php? ... c&start=60

andrewh · Post by **andrewh** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:01 pm

Thank you David. I have pretty much all the parts required, although did you say the rubber washer goes inside the canister or under the bolt head? Thin rubber ring understood. Not long now until lift off!

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:04 pm

Thick rubber washer goes on bolt before you fit the cannister. So under bolt to act as seal against outside face of cannister.

Link:
BBcode:
HTML:
	Hide post links

Link:
BBcode:
HTML:
	Hide post links

Link:
BBcode:
HTML:
	Hide post links

Link:
BBcode:
HTML:
	Hide post links

Link:
BBcode:
HTML:
	Hide post links

The 'E' Type Forum

Oil Filter - spin off or traditional?

#1 Oil Filter - spin off or traditional?

#2

#3

#4

#5

#6

#7

#8

#9

#10

#11

#12

#13

#14

#15

#16

#17

#18

#19

#20