S1 FHC viewing help

TrevS · Post by **TrevS** » Wed May 13, 2015 6:46 pm

Hi all

This is my first post on here so hello all and hopefully you can help make my dream of e-type ownership a reality. I am due to see a 67 FHC on Friday. I spoke to the owner today who said he finished restoring the car 2 years ago and it sounds like a excellent driver car in good condition. The only thing the owner doesn't have is a heritage certificate and he doesn't know if the car is matching numbers. Can someone tell me if this is something I should be worried about and if it's easy to be able to find the engine and gearbox number on these and where they can be located? Also should I get a copy of the heritage certificate before any purchase to check original car colour, production date etc or can that be identified on the car? Finally any words of wisdom on what to look out for would be much appreciated. This will be the 2nd e-type I've looked at and I've generally been checking all the major areas for rust listed in the buyers guide and checking for signs of corrosion as that seems to be the main area of concern on these cars. I am also considering paying for a professional inspection so if anyone has any thoughts on if they are worthwhile that would also be useful.

Thanks

Trevor

Post by **mgcjag** » Wed May 13, 2015 8:40 pm

Hi Trevor....anyone with experiance of e types will be a bonus when u view...matching numbers have been discussed here before and its debatable as to what real difference it makes...as to colour many owners restoring a car go for the colour scheme they prefer rather than the original...so the heritage cert dosent really make much defference it just shows what was the original spec..... if this is a high value car u are looking at u should definatly consider an inspection....let us know more details of your location and what u are looking at and u may find there is someone local that can assist....all the best Steve

Post by **Heuer** » Wed May 13, 2015 8:59 pm

Speak to Angus asap: www.mossjaguar.com

TrevS · Post by **TrevS** » Thu May 14, 2015 9:52 am

Thanks for the replies. The car I am looking at is a 67 series 1 FHC. The car is being advertised at ?70k so I would consider this to be a high value car. My plan was to take a look at the car myself and make sure it's the one and then try and do a deal on the provision of a professional inspection. The car is up near Sheffield and I am going up tomorrow morning so if anyone fancies taking a look with me I certainly won't turn down the help. As for matching numbers, it doesn't bother me too much but as this is a higher value car I want to make sure I am not limiting the cars resale value in the future as I see buyers getting more fussy as the cars continue to move into the collector cars realm of pricing.

Trev

Post by **Heuer** » Thu May 14, 2015 10:03 am

Drive it over to Ken Verity at Series 1 Spares in Rotherham (only a few miles away from Sheffield) and get him to check it over: 01709 838352 Hugely knowledgeable and his charges are reasonable.

Also read this so you know what you are looking at: JCNA S1 Judge's Guide: http://www.jcna.com/library/tech/e-type1.pdf

You can pay ?70k and still end up with a huge amount of trouble and expense!

TrevS · Post by **TrevS** » Thu May 14, 2015 11:12 am

Thanks for the info David. I believe the car has been looked after by a company called Hutsons in Bradford who recently did a top end rebuild on the engine. Does anyone know these guys and what they are like?
http://www.e-typecars.co.uk/contactus.html

Do you think it's worth giving them a call to see if they can tell me anything about the car?

Trev

Post by **Heuer** » Thu May 14, 2015 11:15 am

Very well thought of Company both for the quality of their restorations and parts supply. Give Andy Rayner at Hustons a call and see what he knows about the car.

Don't worry too much about 'matching numbers' as many people replace the gearbox with a 5 speed and that just leaves the engine. It should be 4.2 obviously and it would be nice for it to be out of an S1. Heritage certificate is nice to have but it only tells you how the car left the Factory.

budmarston@aol.com · Post by **budmarston@aol.com** » Thu May 14, 2015 2:37 pm

Hello, Trevor ?

I recommend healthy skepticism and great caution as you consider a ?70k E-type driver.

First, the owner restored the car but doesn?t know if it has matching numbers? He?s hoping for ?70k but did not take a few minutes to order a Heritage certificate? Reasons enough to be very wary. You should assume non-matching numbers until proven otherwise.
- I differ with others on the importance of matching numbers. At least in the U.S., matching numbers is quite important and usually increases the value of an E-type.
- In the absence of a Heritage certificate, check the four numbers on the data plate in the engine bay against the individual component numbers. If the numbers do not match, than it?s a non-matching numbers car.
- If the numbers match, the car has matching numbers if the data plate has not been altered. A professional inspector can do this in 5 minutes.

Second, changing colors during restoration is not unusual and often done: but beware, your car should have an exterior/interior color combination that was correct for 1967 E-type coupes, or the car?s resale value almost certainly will be diminished. Personally, I would not buy an E-type with incorrect period colors.

Third, the quality of restorations ranges from excellent to mediocre or worse, and many issues often are covered up. You should ask the seller to describe his restoration in detail and require a lot of photos of the car taken during the restoration as proof. Otherwise, determining whether the monocoque, for example, is sound can be problematical. The very best advice by others to your query is to get a professional inspection done. A professional inspection of an E-type may be one of the best financial decisions you will ever make!!

Let us know your impressions of the 1967 E-type after you?ve seen it!!

David Oslo · Post by **David Oslo** » Fri May 15, 2015 9:07 am

I would also be looking to perform a due dilegence on all the receipts the current owner (e.g. restorer) has, and also a DD on his (presumed) extensive photo documentation of all the processes, whether done by himself or outsourced to others. I'm thinking in terms of sheet metal work, body prep, painting, engine rebuild, gearbox, suspension, brakes etc.

No receipts & no photos = no deal !

Agree otherwise with previous post, my alarm bells were ringing as soon as I saw that the owner didn't know if it was matching numbers and hadn't ordered a Heritage certificate (even if to just top-off the work done). He's either not very hands-on, or somethings not being told.

As always, buyer beware.

Fingers crossed and good luck.

drcarrera · Post by **drcarrera** » Fri May 15, 2015 11:14 am

I looked at several S1 cars recently, all up for more than ?70K, and with one notable exception the standard of "restoration" was very poor. I was quite shocked at how good a car can look in photos and how bad it can be in reality!
So my advice would be to approach it with a high level of scepticism. Then you won't be too disappointed and may be pleasantly surprised if it's a good 'un!

TrevS · Post by **TrevS** » Fri May 22, 2015 10:42 am

Hi all

Thought I'd give you all a quick update on this. After viewing the car and speaking with the owner on the phone he confirmed that it wasn't a matching numbers car but it does have the correct period 4.2 engine.

This didn't put me and after viewing the car and speaking with the owner I was confident that the car was right for my budget. It was restored 2 years ago with the owner spending well over ?20k in parts alone from Hutsons with all receipts and photos to document the restoration. It's had new interior, brakes, wheels, front sub frame, radiator etc etc, the receipts were endless.

It's also got paperwork dating back from 1982 which is nice to have and the current owner has clearly tried to get the car up to a good condition and not cut corners on parts.

However with all that said it's not perfect. The paint isn't fantastic, and level of restoration is not to the standard I would have done it but it's a good solid driver that needs a bit of finishing off to make it look great.

After speaking with Hutson's (who were fantastic help) I decided to buy the car and plan to take the car to them at the end of the year to see what we can do in the short to medium term to preserve the car for maybe 5-10 years until I feel the urge to do a full bare metal restoration.

I was a little nervous about buying such an expensive classic but my heart said yes and with basket case UK cars selling for over ?40k and prices rising so fast on these cars i just didn't know when another series 1 UK car was likely to come on the market at between ?60-70k that didn't need load of money thrown at it.

The car is being delivered on Monday so that's when the fun really begins. I can't wait and still can't believe I've bought an etype. Does it get any better. Here are a few pictures of the car for you guys to look at. Would be great to get your thoughts on the purchase. I won't say what I paid for the car but it was under ?70k.

Trev

malcolm · Post by **malcolm** » Fri May 22, 2015 3:11 pm

Looks fantastic. Get the manifolds sorted out and it will be great!

drcarrera · Post by **drcarrera** » Fri May 22, 2015 3:49 pm

Congratulations! Looks a good one...

TrevS · Post by **TrevS** » Fri May 22, 2015 4:07 pm

malcolm wrote:Looks fantastic. Get the manifolds sorted out and it will be great!

Any idea what the best treatment is for the manifolds. I lloked at ceramic coating but someone said it tends to not last.

Jeremy · Post by **Jeremy** » Mon Mar 07, 2016 7:28 pm

You probably got the manifold sorted long ago, but if not, have a look at Zircotec. I've read good reports about their process.

neil4444 · Post by **neil4444** » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:05 pm

Hi Trevor,

There has been much discussion on this subject within the forum. The upshot is that any of the coatings have a tendency to crack & peel and the best solution is to wire brush & paint with bbq paint.

Regards,

malcolm · Post by **malcolm** » Tue Mar 08, 2016 12:32 pm

Or, if you don't mind being non-original, go the new stainless steel route. I like the look of it, especially when they Brown:-

richard btype · Post by **richard btype** » Tue Mar 08, 2016 5:34 pm

As a matter of interest what is the paint colour - difficult from photos to tell.

Looks like a nice fettling project, you should find the 'Factory Fit 4.2' useful (check on the Series 1 posts) - good luck!

(Bring it to the Bicester meet on Sunday 24th April?)...

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