Govt. electric car plans - effect on us

[PhilP]

I think you summed it up nicely with your last paragraph let’s all drive our cars and enjoy them while we are still hear. I know when I finally drive away from this world my daughters will only sell it and probably buy electric cars anyway

[richard btype]

The thing that is always missing from this kind of debate is the real cost of providing electricity as the energy source. Presently the cost of supply and dispensing appears cheap, at one time so did diesel...

I would like to see a properly costed debate; the power stations, the chemicals required to manufacture batteries, and disposal of them, none of these costs ever seems to be factored in. The Tesla's of this world are skimming along on the back of this system. When they do start to look at it in detail, a way will be found to apply a taxation system.

Secondly, if we are to go all electric - what would be the first thing to take down to totally disable a country?
I believe we saw a humorous take on this angle with one of my all time favourite films "The Italian Job" and the breakdown of the traffic light system in Turin.

The internal combustion engine is an amazing design and providing fuel is available it makes a tremendous independent source of energy.

[Mark Gordon]

Good points, Richard. When Maria hit Puerto Rico last month, the power grid was nearly completely destroyed. I saw a report yesterday that said that only about 20% of the grid has been restored and it may be until early next summer until everyone has power. In the US, weather related power failures (hurricanes, tornadoes, winter storms, earthquakes) of 2-3 days are not terribly uncommon. At least when a weather event is predicted, you can always go out and fill your gas (petrol) tank beforehand and still get around until power is restored. And it's my understanding that with the interlocking power grid being largely computer controlled, a real concern is a shutdown due to hacking by nefarious sorts.

[politeperson]

If you have no electricity, the pumps dont work and you have no gas.

How a system of discovering, extracting, refining, distributing, transporting, storing marketing and selling a highly volatile (flash point 27 degrees) poisonous substance has evolved to its current level of popularity will be viewed by our grandchildren in future years as the ultimate folly. Some would say we have held hands with those that want to destroy us for over 100 years.

The distribution network for electricity is the easy part. The political motivation to change is the difficult part.

I was in London again yesterday and it stinks of unburnt hydrocarbons.

Oil companies and Governments have made a laughing stock of all of us. Its amazing what urban dwellers tolerate in terms of air quality.

But my strong belief is the classic car movement will continue to thrive, thats what I hope anyway.

[Steve Marshall]

The cost of petrol has not been a big part of the cost of E-Type ownership for me. Even if it doubled that would still be true (and I have done most of my 3000 mile allowance.

[malcolm]

The cost of petrol has not been a big part of the cost of E-Type ownership for me. Even if it doubled that would still be true (and I have done most of my 3000 mile allowance.

For me, it's not so much the cost but the availability that could potentially become an issue.

[cactusman]

Petrol will be around for a while yet....ships and planes will need hydrocarbon fuels for a while yet and making aviation fuel and diesel necessarily mean production of lighter distillate including petrol....who knows it may become a nuisance by product they just want rid off....I live in hope

[chrisfell]

I did some back of envelope calcs the other day, just to frighten myself. 55,000 E-Typing miles has cost me around £13k in petrol. As a comparison I thought I would see how much a Tesla would cost to run over the same distance using my standard tariff elastic-trickery, and Tesla’s own energy consumption rates. That came to £3,500 or about 1/4 of the cost.

[cactusman]

But can you put a price on the sound of an xk engine on song or the grins and waves from other car owners and pedestrians in my humble opinion....no....Teslas look quite smart and are doubtless efficient but dont stir the soul like an 'E' for me...

[Series1 Stu]

Teslas look quite smart and are doubtless efficient but dont stir the soul like an 'E' for me...

Standing where we are today, I fully agree with you. But who knows what nostalgia may surround the first generation Tesla when it reaches its 50th birthday? I don't think I'll be around to see it but I'm sure there'll be some affection for them. After all, they were the first all electric car to offer a sensible range and a well thought out charging infrastructure.

Regards

[Mark Gordon]

Petrol will be around for a while yet....ships and planes will need hydrocarbon fuels for a while yet and making aviation fuel and diesel necessarily mean production of lighter distillate including petrol....who knows it may become a nuisance by product they just want rid off....I live in hope

You may very well be right. I remember when I was a school boy, I had to prepare a report on the early petroleum business. When crude oil was first commercially extracted, its main use was to distill it to produce kerosene (paraffin?) for use in lamps and lanterns in replace of whale oil. Gasoline (petrol) was a useless byproduct that the refineries would give away for free if you would just haul it off.

[cactusman]

I live in eternal hope Mark.....I will be waiting outside the refinery with a couple of Jerry cans

[malcolm]

Some interesting stuff I've found specifically regarding the Tesla - not as green as we may think!:

"Research recently published by the Trancik Lab of the highly esteemed Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) could wipe the smug expressions off thousands of electric car drivers’ faces.
The boffins at the Trancik Lab have shown that an electric Tesla Model S P100D saloon produces more carbon dioxide, at 226g per kilometre, than a petrol-driven run-around such as the Mitsubishi Mirage, which is responsible for just 192g/km"


This is partly because 51% of the energy used to recharge the batteries comes from fossil-fuel power stations

Furthermore, the European commission has showed that HALF of all particulate matter generated comes from Tyre and brake dust, of which Teslas produce more as they are heavier.

Then there's the batteries. It is believed that 11 million tons of batteries will be thrown away in the next 10 years, of which only 5% will be recycled.

Also, mining the Nickel and Lithium required is a major issue:

"The third part of the problem lies in those batteries. Mining the huge amounts of nickel, cobalt and lithium used in their manufacture comes at an environmental cost. As Mr Meilhan says: ‘If you switch from oil to cobalt and lithium, you have not addressed any problem. You have just switched your problem.’
A 2009 study revealed that nickel was the eighth worst metal to mine and process in terms of global warming and pollution. Villagers who live next to the Cerro Matoso nickel mine in Colombia, for example, have reported higher rates of respiratory diseases and birth defects.
Producing lithium also has an environmental cost, as rocks need to be crushed, often in Australia, and then shipped to China to be processed. The lithium extracted from South American deserts results in one ton of carbon dioxide for every ton of lithium carbonate produced."

[mystery type]

the 500,000 hgv's on our roads ?

Tesla plans to reveal electric lorry ...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41263152

[vikla]

...and the latest Tesla 2 seater roadster...
https://www.whatcar.com/news/new-tesla- ... e=20171117