Splitting front frame and engine assemby from body Series 1

Steve_B · Post by **Steve_B** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:14 pm

Hello all.

I am certain I read somewhere that you can separate the front end of an E-type from the body shell as a sub assembly with the engine and transmission, suspension, and all the items still attached so that it can be wheeled away as a complete unit.

I know that a number of items would have to be removed ; bonnet, radiator (possibly), harness, mechanical and hydraulic connections etc.

Has anyone done this? If so any comments?

Thank you.
Steve Bryant

Series 1.5 FHC

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:50 pm

Comment? Send us a postcard from hospital :-)

ands59 · Post by **ands59** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 4:59 pm

Hi I did it with a donor car and was like a wheelbarrow and surprisingly easy to move around.
Good luck

Post by **Heuer** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:03 pm

There is Factory photo on here somewhere that shows the engine assembled onto the frame before it was bolted to the monocoque. Suspension was not on though.

christopher storey · Post by **christopher storey** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 5:18 pm

This poses several questions : 1. why on earth would you want to do this ?

2.what, other than minimal ( and questionable ) savings of time would be achieved?

3.How would you support the rear end of the engine/gearbox ?

4.How would you reliably relieve the loads on the bulkhead fastenings , and even more so the torsion bars , whilst accomplishing the detachment operation ?

Getting the engine out is not a difficult operation and can be accomplished on one's own in about 4 hours ( either upwards or downwards at one's option ) with very ordinary lifting gear, either a crane or block and tackle

Moeregaard · Post by **Moeregaard** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 6:41 pm

christopher storey wrote:This poses several questions : 1. why on earth would you want to do this ?

2.what, other than minimal ( and questionable ) savings of time would be achieved?

3.How would you support the rear end of the engine/gearbox ?

4.How would you reliably relieve the loads on the bulkhead fastenings , and even more so the torsion bars , whilst accomplishing the detachment operation ?

Getting the engine out is not a difficult operation and can be accomplished on one's own in about 4 hours ( either upwards or downwards at one's option ) with very ordinary lifting gear, either a crane or block and tackle

Once again, Christopher has nailed it. Seriously, though, removal of all the bits forward of the firewall goes very quickly once the engine and gearbox are out. When I restored my '65, I had everything off and catalogued in a weekend.

abowie · Post by **abowie** » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:39 pm

The above replies will tell you that yes it's possible but not much use from a practical perspective. You won't be able to wheelbarrow it about because without the torsion bars fixed into the tie plate there is no spring to support the front suspension.

I've never done it because I've never seen a need. Note also that all the wiring and hydraulics are attached to the frames too so it's not just the firewall bolts you have to deal with. AS above, you will also still have to take the torsion bars and reaction tie plate off anyway.

The E type engine and gearbox are unwieldy and very heavy. The best and safest approach to getting these components out is to do it step-wise and break things down into smaller, more manageable bits.

Steve_B · Post by **Steve_B** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 12:43 am

To all who replied: thank you for your input.

I have removed the engine and gearbox from e-types a number of times and am familiar with the issues and weight of said unit. I also understand the problems inherent with supporting the unsupported back end of things to allow separation and am familiar with all the "stuff" that has to be removed when separating the frame from the body shell.

I learned a long time ago that one doesn't always save on time and energy when trying not to disassemble everything as opposed to cutting corners.

I was just looking to see if I could keep the dis-assembly down to large lumps in order to restore the sheet metal in the body shell without the frame etc. on the front and stripping everything off of it.

Just a case of just wondering out loud here on the forums whether it was something that could be done vs doing what should be done.

Again thank you for your all your concerns etc.

Stephen

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Sat Aug 01, 2015 11:50 am

Steve_B wrote:To all who replied: thank you for your input.

Just a case of just wondering out loud here on the forums whether it was something that could be done vs doing what should be done.

Nothing wrong with asking. If you were just stripping a scrap car and hacking through wires and minor plumbing I could even countenance something similiar (once the suspension was de-tensioned) to get it all in a van or on a general purpose trailer quickly.

Since you are repairing a car and would want to reinstall the front end onto the tub, the problems are more or less doubled as re-assembly would be tricky. Jaguar did assemble them that way (at least for a few photos) but everything was new, unstressed and properly jig-aligned.

Steve_B · Post by **Steve_B** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 2:04 pm

Thought you all might like a look at the car in question:

image sharing

The care will be reverting back to it's original colour of Opalescent Maroon once the body shell repairs are completed.
Steve_B

Post by **Heuer** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 2:14 pm

The Factory way:

Steve_B · Post by **Steve_B** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 2:48 pm

David,
thank you for finding this photo. I'm always interested in how the factory did things originally.

Steve_B

Mark Gordon · Post by **Mark Gordon** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 3:40 pm

The photo shows how (according to Phillip Porter) the assembly was originally done but Porter goes on to state, "Later in the E-Type's life this was revised and the bare sub-frame was first affixed to the body, to be followed by the fitting of the engine and other items attached to the sub-frame, which is reminiscent of the front of the C-Type chassis and certainly similar to a D-Type."
My take from this is that after trying to fit the engine/gearbox/sub-frames as a unit, the practice was abandoned for the later method due to ease or safety reasons.

Steve_B · Post by **Steve_B** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 3:52 pm

The later method would make more sense in the scheme of things I think as others have stated that it is easier to assemble the front frame without all the other bits getting in the way and making alignment difficult.

Thanks for this

Steve_B

PeterCrespin · Post by **PeterCrespin** » Sun Aug 02, 2015 5:38 pm

It also explains why some cars had topcoated bulkheads under the subframe plates and unpainted fasteners, where others had the opposite.

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Splitting front frame and engine assemby from body Series 1

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